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[Because My Tears Are Delicious to You] Justice Inc. by Paul Ernst
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James Nicoll
2017-07-02 13:22:24 UTC
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Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst

http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My Livejournal at http://www.livejournal.com/users/james_nicoll
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-07-02 16:17:19 UTC
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Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.

Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.

Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books written in
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart mode, which
would be.. interesting)
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Kevrob
2017-07-02 19:14:47 UTC
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books written in
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart mode, which
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and Doc's too,
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National credited
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name. Michael Uslan
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil. Again, "Maxwell
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O and, for a few
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan, who went on
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.

https://www.comics.org/issue/28635/cover/4/

Marvel credited their own writers on Doc, from Roy Thomas to Gardner
Fox and workhorse Doug Moench, who wrote the long stories in the
black-and-white magazine version. I knew that Robeson and Grant
were house names, since I was able to buy both volumes of the
Steranko HISTORY OF COMICS in a bookstore in Chicago's Loop -
probably a Kroch's and Brentano's - on a trip there in May of `73,
for a national high school debate tournament. It had a long chapter
on the pulp heroes who prefigured their comic book counterparts,
even mentioning the likes of Campbell's Aarn Munro (The Mightiest
Machine) as a SUPERMAN precursor. Aarn, like Kal-L, was raised
on a planet with heavier gravity than Terra, Jupiter.

I had seen the Belmont Shadows and Bantam Savage reprints in local
stores before then, but didn't have enough spare cash to buy them.
The local library fed my prose jones pretty well, but the only
"pulp" it carried were SF reprints from that era, detective fiction
that was first printed in the likes of BLACK MASK, and the descendants
of the pulps in the periodical section: analog, ELLERY QUEEN's and
others that had converted to digest size.

Kevin R
Kevrob
2017-07-02 19:24:31 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* .....
*Hanging footnote; apologies. This is also why the Gold Key comic
reprinting strips from Britain's TV COMIC was called "John Steed
and Emma Peel," at least on the cover.

https://www.comics.org/issue/298375/

Kevin R
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-07-02 22:08:10 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books written in
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart mode, which
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and Doc's too,
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National credited
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name. Michael Uslan
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil. Again, "Maxwell
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O and, for a few
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan, who went on
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.
My memory is that the O'Neil Docs were dreadful. The current series from
Dynamite is probably the best Doc has been done in the comics.
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Kevrob
2017-07-03 00:09:23 UTC
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books written in
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart mode, which
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and Doc's too,
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National credited
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name. Michael Uslan
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil. Again, "Maxwell
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O and, for a few
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan, who went on
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.
My memory is that the O'Neil Docs were dreadful.
I concur. Perhaps trying to ape the Chaykin Shadow that DC released
a year earlier, I bounced off the 1987 DC Doc hard. Too many changes
for the sake of change. When the story moved to the present day,
and we got a Clark Savage (IV?),a grandson,running around - yech!

I was a big O'Neil fan from the mid-60s on (Wander, GL/GA, the
revival of "the scary Batman,") but his Doc and his take on Ditko's
THE QUESTION left me cold - completely askew from the original
concept. It should have starred a new character.
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
The current series from
Dynamite is probably the best Doc has been done in the comics.
Haven't read those. I sorta went cold turkey on comics a while
back. I buy one, and before you know it I'm spending the rent
for the furshlugginer things.

Kevin R
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-07-03 00:21:55 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books written in
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart mode, which
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and Doc's too,
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National credited
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name. Michael Uslan
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil. Again, "Maxwell
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O and, for a few
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan, who went on
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.
My memory is that the O'Neil Docs were dreadful.
I concur. Perhaps trying to ape the Chaykin Shadow that DC released
a year earlier, I bounced off the 1987 DC Doc hard. Too many changes
for the sake of change. When the story moved to the present day,
and we got a Clark Savage (IV?),a grandson,running around - yech!
OK, yep. That's the run I was remembering. And the idea of the college
doing lobotomies -- a better retcon would be some sort of temporary amnesia.
Oh, and Ham as a scared old man in the granson era..
Post by Kevrob
I was a big O'Neil fan from the mid-60s on (Wander, GL/GA, the
revival of "the scary Batman,") but his Doc and his take on Ditko's
THE QUESTION left me cold - completely askew from the original
concept. It should have starred a new character.
Yeah, O'Neil is not a bad writer, but was a very bad *fit*.
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
The current series from
Dynamite is probably the best Doc has been done in the comics.
Haven't read those. I sorta went cold turkey on comics a while
back. I buy one, and before you know it I'm spending the rent
for the furshlugginer things.
Amelia Erhart, lots of Pat, the big bad of Doc villans, and the guys actually
playing as 5 distinct personalities. It could fall apart, but so far it's
pretty good.
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
David Johnston
2017-07-03 13:30:44 UTC
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books written in
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart mode, which
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and Doc's too,
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National credited
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name. Michael Uslan
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil. Again, "Maxwell
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O and, for a few
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan, who went on
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.
My memory is that the O'Neil Docs were dreadful.
I concur. Perhaps trying to ape the Chaykin Shadow that DC released
a year earlier, I bounced off the 1987 DC Doc hard. Too many changes
for the sake of change. When the story moved to the present day,
and we got a Clark Savage (IV?),a grandson,running around - yech!
OK, yep. That's the run I was remembering. And the idea of the college
doing lobotomies --
The original series idea of surgically removing a person's ability to be a criminal does in fact boil down to that.
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-07-03 14:09:44 UTC
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books
written in
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart
mode, which
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and Doc's too,
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National credited
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name.
Michael Uslan
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil. Again, "Maxwell
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O and, for a few
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan, who went on
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.
My memory is that the O'Neil Docs were dreadful.
I concur. Perhaps trying to ape the Chaykin Shadow that DC released
a year earlier, I bounced off the 1987 DC Doc hard. Too many changes
for the sake of change. When the story moved to the present day,
and we got a Clark Savage (IV?),a grandson,running around - yech!
OK, yep. That's the run I was remembering. And the idea of the college
doing lobotomies --
The original series idea of surgically removing a person's ability to be
a criminal does in fact boil down to that.
Not exactly. We meet a graduate at least once, and he's a normal guy.
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
David Johnston
2017-07-03 15:53:01 UTC
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books
written in
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart
mode, which
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and Doc's too,
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National credited
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name.
Michael Uslan
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil. Again, "Maxwell
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O and, for a few
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan, who went on
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.
My memory is that the O'Neil Docs were dreadful.
I concur. Perhaps trying to ape the Chaykin Shadow that DC released
a year earlier, I bounced off the 1987 DC Doc hard. Too many changes
for the sake of change. When the story moved to the present day,
and we got a Clark Savage (IV?),a grandson,running around - yech!
OK, yep. That's the run I was remembering. And the idea of the college
doing lobotomies --
The original series idea of surgically removing a person's ability to be
a criminal does in fact boil down to that.
exc
Not exactly. We meet a graduate at least once, and he's a normal guy.
oLbotomy patients didn't necessarily come off as not being normal. Whatshername, the woman from the original King Kong movie, had a lobotomy and you couldn't tell just from talking to her afterward.

But regardless of whether he seemed normal enough he had to be somehow mentally handicapped because that was the point of the operation, to remove his capability to be a threat.
Kevrob
2017-07-03 18:27:29 UTC
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Lobotomy patients didn't necessarily come off as not being normal. Whatshername, the woman from the original King Kong movie,
Fay Wray?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fay_Wray

Jessica Lange, who was in the 1976 KONG remake in the Wray part,
played Frances Farmer in FRANCES, and was nominated for an
Oscar for the role.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frances_Farmer

It is claimed Farmer had a lobotomy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frances_Farmer#Lobotomy_claims

Probably didn't happen.
had a lobotomy and you couldn't tell just from talking to her afterward.
But regardless of whether he seemed normal enough he had to be somehow mentally handicapped because that was the point of the operation, to remove his capability to be a threat.
Kevin R
h***@gmail.com
2017-07-04 00:46:09 UTC
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Post by David Johnston
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books
written in
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart
mode, which
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and Doc's too,
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National credited
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name.
Michael Uslan
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil. Again, "Maxwell
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O and, for a few
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan, who went on
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.
My memory is that the O'Neil Docs were dreadful.
I concur. Perhaps trying to ape the Chaykin Shadow that DC released
a year earlier, I bounced off the 1987 DC Doc hard. Too many changes
for the sake of change. When the story moved to the present day,
and we got a Clark Savage (IV?),a grandson,running around - yech!
OK, yep. That's the run I was remembering. And the idea of the college
doing lobotomies --
The original series idea of surgically removing a person's ability to be
a criminal does in fact boil down to that.
exc
Not exactly. We meet a graduate at least once, and he's a normal guy.
oLbotomy patients didn't necessarily come off as not being normal. Whatshername, the woman from the original King Kong movie, had a lobotomy and you couldn't tell just from talking to her afterward.
But regardless of whether he seemed normal enough he had to be somehow mentally handicapped because that was the point of the operation, to remove his capability to be a threat.
In magic fiction world you may be able to surgically stop somebody's criminal tendencies without otherwise affecting them.
Especially in something dating back to the 1930s
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-07-04 02:01:39 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Post by David Johnston
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
On Sunday, July 2, 2017 at 12:17:24 PM UTC-4, Ted Nolan
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by James Nicoll
Justice, Inc. (Avenger, book 1) Paul Ernst
http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/review/aint-no-sunshine
Because I thought the books were by the same author who
wrote Doc Savage, I was surprised that, in the Avenger
books, Benson had allies rather than subordinates, allies
with skills he cannot duplicate2.. Whereas Doc Savage's
pals were all useful, but because Doc was always just a bit
better than any of them, he didn't really need them.
Not entirely true... I don't think it was ever said that Doc was a
better lawyer than Ham.
Also, Ron Goulart was Kenneth Robeson for some "Avenger" books
written in
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
the 70s iirc. (Sadly, they were not written in the Ron Goulart
mode, which
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
would be.. interesting)
When DC comics adopted The Avenger, the title JUSTICE, INC, was used,
as Marvel's THE AVENGERS had been going strong since 1963,and had the
trademark for comic books.* While Marvel had the DOC SAVAGE license,
DC had no compunction in using the Kenneth Robeson name, and
Doc's too,
Post by David Johnston
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
on the covers in a failed attempt to drum up sales. National
credited
Post by David Johnston
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Denny O'Neil as the scripter, rather than use S&S pen-name.
Michael Uslan
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
wrote a few issues of THE SHADOW, filling in for O'Neil.
Again, "Maxwell
Post by David Johnston
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Grant" wasn't credited in the DC comics, but rather Denny O
and, for a few
Post by David Johnston
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
issues, including a Shadow/Avenger crossover, Michael Uslan,
who went on
Post by David Johnston
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Kevrob
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
to produce the BATMAN film series started in 1989.
My memory is that the O'Neil Docs were dreadful.
I concur. Perhaps trying to ape the Chaykin Shadow that DC released
a year earlier, I bounced off the 1987 DC Doc hard. Too many changes
for the sake of change. When the story moved to the present day,
and we got a Clark Savage (IV?),a grandson,running around - yech!
OK, yep. That's the run I was remembering. And the idea of the college
doing lobotomies --
The original series idea of surgically removing a person's ability to be
a criminal does in fact boil down to that.
exc
Not exactly. We meet a graduate at least once, and he's a normal guy.
oLbotomy patients didn't necessarily come off as not being normal.
Whatshername, the woman from the original King Kong movie, had a
lobotomy and you couldn't tell just from talking to her afterward.
Post by David Johnston
But regardless of whether he seemed normal enough he had to be somehow
mentally handicapped because that was the point of the operation, to
remove his capability to be a threat.
In magic fiction world you may be able to surgically stop somebody's
criminal tendencies without otherwise affecting them.
Especially in something dating back to the 1930s
Yes, this. I can't remmember which book it was, but the guy was either the
protag or a major character. His ex associates had found him, and wanted
him back, and he didn't want to have anything to do with it. We spend a lot
of time with him, and he's ok.

That's why my handwave for a retcon would be something like electro stimulation
to induce temporary amnesia and then a good socialization regime. O'Neils
whole approach seemed to be designed to diminish Doc & the guys for some reason.
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