Discussion:
OT, or pure fiction? Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later Than 2023
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a425couple
2018-07-07 18:24:37 UTC
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https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/

The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later Than
2023
Blue Origin/NASA/Victor Tangermann
by Kristin Houser July 5, 2018 Off World
LUNAR UPDATE. A.C. Charania, business development director for Blue
Origin, says the private aerospace company plans to complete a lunar
landing mission before 2023, which would eventually “enable human lunar
return.” That is: send humans back to the Moon.

That’s an earlier, and more specific, timeframe than anyone at the
company had specified up to this point — last year, the Washington Post
reported that its Blue Moon project — which includes plans to colonize
the Moon, as well as an Amazon-like Moon delivery service — was slated
for the mid-2020s.

This news about Blue Origin’s came during the Space Frontier
Foundation’s NewSpace conference in Renton, Washington, in late June,
according to a GeekWire report.


A LITTLE HELP FROM NASA. Blue Origin first revealed its ambitions for a
Moon colony in March 2017. “It is time for America to return to the Moon
— this time to stay,” Bezos told The Washington Post. “A permanently
inhabited lunar settlement is a difficult and worthy objective. I sense
a lot of people are excited about this.”

At the time, Blue Origin was looking to NASA and the U.S. government for
assistance in the endeavor. Since then, it’s become one of 10 companies
chosen to share $10 million in NASA funding for lunar research. That has
apparently helped the company to move up the timeframe for when Blue
Moon might be accomplished.

“Blue Moon is on our roadmap, and because of our scale, because of what
we see from the government, we brought it a little bit forward in time,”
Charania said during the NewSpace conference. “I think we are very
excited to now implement this long-term commercial solution with NASA
partnership.”

A CROWDED SPACE. Blue Origin isn’t the only aerospace company eying a
return to the Moon. SpaceX has floated plans for future Moon
colonization, while NASA, China Manned Space Agency, and Russia’s space
agency Roscosmos all have manned lunar missions in the works.


With so many organizations in on the effort, it seems like it’s only a
matter of time before humans take that one small step once again.

https://www.geekwire.com/2018/blue-origin-targets-moon-landing-2023-early-step-toward-lunar-settlement/

Blue Origin targets moon landing by 2023 as an early step toward lunar
settlement
BY ALAN BOYLE on July 3, 2018 at 3:15 pm

A.C. Charania
A.C. Charania, Blue Origin’s business development director, addresses
the NewSpace conference with a picture of his company’s founder, Jeff
Bezos, looming in the background. (GeekWire Photo / Alan Boyle)
Blue Origin, the space venture founded by Amazon billionaire Jeff Bezos,
is laying out a plan to support the creation of permanent settlements on
the moon, starting with a lunar landing mission within the next five years.

The Kent, Wash.-based company’s roadmap was laid out most recently last
week during the Space Frontier Foundation’s NewSpace conference in
Renton, Wash.

Blue Origin’s business development director, A.C. Charania, said the
company’s Blue Moon program is “our first step to developing a lunar
landing capability for the country, for other customers internationally,
to be able to land multi metric tons on the lunar surface.”

“Any permanent human presence on the lunar surface will require such a
capability,” he said.

Charania said “we’re actively working on the descent stage for Blue
Moon, the capabilities, the partnerships that are required to enable
that service … to start going back to the moon with larger and larger
payloads.”

Blue Moon could help answer longstanding scientific questions about the
moon’s origin and evolution, delve into lunar resource identification
and extraction, and “enable human lunar return,” Charania said.

Charania told GeekWire that the first Blue Moon landing could take place
even before 2023.

Blue Origin’s executives have talked about a five-year time frame for
lunar landings several times over the past year, but Charania’s comments
made clear that the company is looking for international partnerships as
well as support from NASA.


“Blue Moon is on our roadmap,” Charania said, “and because of our scale,
because of what we see from the government, we brought it a little bit
forward in time. I think we are very excited to now implement this
long-term commercial solution with NASA partnership.”

In May, Australia’s InnovationAus.com quoted another Blue Origin
executive, Ted McFarland, as suggesting that Bezos and international
representatives could announce a back-to-the-moon initiative in
September at the International Astronautical Congress in Germany.
(German news media quoted IAC officials as saying they haven’t yet heard
from Blue Origin about that idea.)

NASA is already ramping up its plans for lunar landings, in response to
initiatives endorsed by the Trump administration. This month, the space
agency is due to solicit proposals for commercial lunar payload
services, with proposals due in mid-August and the first landings due by
the end of next year.

Landers capable of putting several tons on the lunar surface are in
NASA’s roadmap for the early 2020s, which meshes with Blue Origin’s time
frame. Other companies, such as Masten Space Systems and Moon Express,
are also working on medium- to heavy-class lunar lander concepts.

Blue Origin has lots more on its agenda for the next few years, backed
with a billion dollars a year from Bezos:

Its suborbital spaceship, New Shepard, is in the midst of uncrewed
flight tests and could start carrying test passengers by the end of 2018.
Its BE-4 rocket engine, fueled by liquefied natural gas, is being
manufactured in Kent and tested at the company’s West Texas facility.
Its orbital-class New Glenn rocket, which will make use of BE-4 rocket
engines, is under development at Blue Origin’s Florida factory and is
due to have its first launch in 2020. Several satellite launch deals
already have been struck for the early 2020s.
Charania said Blue Origin now has more than 1,500 employees, which is
double the figure from two years ago. The company’s website lists more
than 230 job openings, including spots for training coordinators, flight
controllers and an astronaut experience manager.

Blue Origin hasn’t yet set the price for suborbital space trips, but
it’s expected to start selling tickets next year.

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newsletter for top headlines from Alan Boyle, GeekWire’s aerospace and
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GeekWire aerospace and science editor Alan Boyle is an award-winning
science writer and veteran space reporter. Formerly of NBCNews.com, he
is the author of "The Case for Pluto: How a Little Planet Made a Big
Difference." Follow him via CosmicLog.com, on Twitter @b0yle, and on
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Comments
J. Clarke
2018-07-07 18:54:06 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later Than
2023
If they're going to be "colonizing the Moon" in 2023 they better make
a good deal with Elon Musk, because Blue Origin isn't even close to
having a lunar capability, while SpaceX has all the pieces either
flying or scheduled for test this year or early next year.
Dan Tilque
2018-07-07 20:07:16 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by J. Clarke
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later Than
2023
If they're going to be "colonizing the Moon" in 2023 they better make
a good deal with Elon Musk, because Blue Origin isn't even close to
having a lunar capability, while SpaceX has all the pieces either
flying or scheduled for test this year or early next year.
Well, it's not like there's only one place on the Moon that can be
colonized. It's a big place. Although it'd probably be best if the two
coordinated their projects. Personally, I have doubts about that 5-year
plan considering that the rocket engine needed, the BE-4, has not even
flown yet. Things always take longer in space, even when you take this
into account.

Anyone else notice that Blue Origins' suborbital New Shepard will
basically be the world's most expensive amusement park ride? It just
goes straight up, releases the capsule, and then the two parts parachute
back down separately. The rocket lands on the launch pad, I believe, and
the capsule somewhere nearby. Total time, 10-15 minutes.
--
Dan Tilque
Peter Trei
2018-07-07 22:00:26 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
I’m wondering what economic basis is for “colonizing the moon”? Mars is potentially terraformable, the Moon, not so much.

Aside from research, what could we profitably do there?

Mine water from the poles?
Create construction materials?
Start a retirement home?

As far as I can see, the Moon is less colonizable than Antarctica, and it’s only advantage is a much shallower gravity well.

Pt
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2018-07-08 03:00:41 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
I’m wondering what economic basis is for “colonizing the moon”?
Mars is potentially terraformable, the Moon, not so much.
Aside from research, what could we profitably do there?
Mine water from the poles?
Create construction materials?
Start a retirement home?
As far as I can see, the Moon is less colonizable than Antarctica, and
Start with the Blue Area, duh!
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Titus G
2018-07-08 04:46:01 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Peter Trei
I’m wondering what economic basis is for “colonizing the moon”?
Mars is potentially terraformable, the Moon, not so much.
Aside from research, what could we profitably do there?
Mine water from the poles?
Create construction materials?
Start a retirement home?
As far as I can see, the Moon is less colonizable than Antarctica, and
Start with the Blue Area, duh!
Start with a military or spy base disguised as a research centre. As
there are no locals opposed to nuclear power there will be no need to
pretend its all diesel generated electricity, nor will there be a need
to obtain freedom from customs to smuggle in all the secret stuff. With
no locals, the only people stupid enough to fly a plane into a crater,
will be the people who bought the remnants of the Tesla companies, so
there will need to be a conspiracy to discourage tourism. Looking easier
than Antarctica already and we haven't even considered the savings from
being able to use miniature Schnauzers rather than Malamutes.
J. Clarke
2018-07-08 03:02:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Dan Tilque
Post by J. Clarke
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later Than
2023
If they're going to be "colonizing the Moon" in 2023 they better make
a good deal with Elon Musk, because Blue Origin isn't even close to
having a lunar capability, while SpaceX has all the pieces either
flying or scheduled for test this year or early next year.
Well, it's not like there's only one place on the Moon that can be
colonized.
So what? If you don't have the means to get there you aren't going to
colonize it unless you make a deal with someone who _does_ have the
means. SpaceX has the means, Blue Origin doesn't.
Post by Dan Tilque
It's a big place. Although it'd probably be best if the two
coordinated their projects. Personally, I have doubts about that 5-year
plan considering that the rocket engine needed, the BE-4, has not even
flown yet. Things always take longer in space, even when you take this
into account.
Anyone else notice that Blue Origins' suborbital New Shepard will
basically be the world's most expensive amusement park ride? It just
goes straight up, releases the capsule, and then the two parts parachute
back down separately. The rocket lands on the launch pad, I believe, and
the capsule somewhere nearby. Total time, 10-15 minutes.
Precisely. Blue Origin can't even get to the ISS and yet they are
going to colonize the Moon in 5 years? Yeah, right.
Ninapenda Jibini
2018-07-08 04:31:07 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sat, 07 Jul 2018 13:07:16 -0700, Dan Tilque
Post by Dan Tilque
On Sat, 7 Jul 2018 11:24:37 -0700, a425couple
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No
Later Than 2023
If they're going to be "colonizing the Moon" in 2023 they
better make a good deal with Elon Musk, because Blue Origin
isn't even close to having a lunar capability, while SpaceX
has all the pieces either flying or scheduled for test this
year or early next year.
Well, it's not like there's only one place on the Moon that can
be colonized.
So what? If you don't have the means to get there you aren't
going to colonize it unless you make a deal with someone who
_does_ have the means. SpaceX has the means, Blue Origin
doesn't.
SpaceX doesn't either, at the moment, but they are getting damned
close.
--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Dimensional Traveler
2018-07-08 05:22:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dan Tilque
Post by J. Clarke
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later Than
2023
If they're going to be "colonizing the Moon" in 2023 they better make
a good deal with Elon Musk, because Blue Origin isn't even close to
having a lunar capability, while SpaceX has all the pieces either
flying or scheduled for test this year or early next year.
Well, it's not like there's only one place on the Moon that can be
colonized.
So what? If you don't have the means to get there you aren't going to
colonize it unless you make a deal with someone who _does_ have the
means. SpaceX has the means, Blue Origin doesn't.
Post by Dan Tilque
It's a big place. Although it'd probably be best if the two
coordinated their projects. Personally, I have doubts about that 5-year
plan considering that the rocket engine needed, the BE-4, has not even
flown yet. Things always take longer in space, even when you take this
into account.
Anyone else notice that Blue Origins' suborbital New Shepard will
basically be the world's most expensive amusement park ride? It just
goes straight up, releases the capsule, and then the two parts parachute
back down separately. The rocket lands on the launch pad, I believe, and
the capsule somewhere nearby. Total time, 10-15 minutes.
Precisely. Blue Origin can't even get to the ISS and yet they are
going to colonize the Moon in 5 years? Yeah, right.
Reading the original post, its more like "As a first step towards
colonizing the Moon, we will land a robotic craft on the moon in 5 years."
--
Inquiring minds want to know while minds with a self-preservation
instinct are running screaming.
J. Clarke
2018-07-08 05:27:56 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sat, 7 Jul 2018 22:22:33 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
Post by Dimensional Traveler
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dan Tilque
Post by J. Clarke
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later Than
2023
If they're going to be "colonizing the Moon" in 2023 they better make
a good deal with Elon Musk, because Blue Origin isn't even close to
having a lunar capability, while SpaceX has all the pieces either
flying or scheduled for test this year or early next year.
Well, it's not like there's only one place on the Moon that can be
colonized.
So what? If you don't have the means to get there you aren't going to
colonize it unless you make a deal with someone who _does_ have the
means. SpaceX has the means, Blue Origin doesn't.
Post by Dan Tilque
It's a big place. Although it'd probably be best if the two
coordinated their projects. Personally, I have doubts about that 5-year
plan considering that the rocket engine needed, the BE-4, has not even
flown yet. Things always take longer in space, even when you take this
into account.
Anyone else notice that Blue Origins' suborbital New Shepard will
basically be the world's most expensive amusement park ride? It just
goes straight up, releases the capsule, and then the two parts parachute
back down separately. The rocket lands on the launch pad, I believe, and
the capsule somewhere nearby. Total time, 10-15 minutes.
Precisely. Blue Origin can't even get to the ISS and yet they are
going to colonize the Moon in 5 years? Yeah, right.
Reading the original post, its more like "As a first step towards
colonizing the Moon, we will land a robotic craft on the moon in 5 years."
The truth is more like "if a miracle happens in five years we'll put
something in orbit".

David Johnston
2018-07-07 22:41:20 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later Than
2023
 Blue Origin/NASA/Victor Tangermann
by Kristin Houser    July 5, 2018 Off World
LUNAR UPDATE. A.C. Charania, business development director for Blue
Origin, says the private aerospace company plans to complete a lunar
landing mission before 2023, which would eventually “enable human lunar
return.” That is: send humans back to the Moon.
What's that I smell? Could it be a whiff of scam?
J. Clarke
2018-07-08 03:24:22 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Sat, 07 Jul 2018 21:35:31 -0500, Cryptoengineer
Post by David Johnston
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later
Than 2023
 Blue Origin/NASA/Victor Tangermann
by Kristin Houser    July 5, 2018 Off World
LUNAR UPDATE. A.C. Charania, business development director for Blue
Origin, says the private aerospace company plans to complete a lunar
landing mission before 2023, which would eventually “enable human
lunar return.” That is: send humans back to the Moon.
What's that I smell? Could it be a whiff of scam?
Why do you say that? Kennedy's 'We choose to go to the Moon' speech was
given on May 25, 1961. Our first landing mission (Surveyor 1) was June 2,
1966.
We've learned a lot about space exploration since then. I can't see why
it should take longer now than it did 50+ years ago.
In 1961 NASA had demonstrated orbital launch capability and had
already sent objects into the vicinity of the Moon.

Blue Origin has done neither.
Joe Pfeiffer
2018-07-08 03:32:16 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by David Johnston
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No Later
Than 2023
 Blue Origin/NASA/Victor Tangermann
by Kristin Houser    July 5, 2018 Off World
LUNAR UPDATE. A.C. Charania, business development director for Blue
Origin, says the private aerospace company plans to complete a lunar
landing mission before 2023, which would eventually “enable human
lunar return.” That is: send humans back to the Moon.
What's that I smell? Could it be a whiff of scam?
Why do you say that? Kennedy's 'We choose to go to the Moon' speech was
given on May 25, 1961. Our first landing mission (Surveyor 1) was June 2,
1966.
We've learned a lot about space exploration since then. I can't see why
it should take longer now than it did 50+ years ago.
There is a serious disconnect between the headline (colonization begins
2023) and the actual story (moon landing (from context, presumably
unmanned) 2023, eventual manned moon landing sometime after).

The headline is enough of a fantasy to sound like a scam. The actual
story sounds reasonable, for definitions of reasonable that involve
investment on a scale that makes the 1960s space race seem like deciding
not to worry about a nickel you drop on the ground.
Ninapenda Jibini
2018-07-08 04:28:50 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by David Johnston
Post by a425couple
from
https://futurism.com/moon-colonization-blue-origin-2023/
The Digest: Blue Origin Plans to Begin Colonizing the Moon No
Later Than 2023
 Blue Origin/NASA/Victor Tangermann
by Kristin Houser    July 5, 2018 Off World
LUNAR UPDATE. A.C. Charania, business development director for
Blue Origin, says the private aerospace company plans to
complete a lunar landing mission before 2023, which would
eventually “enable human lunar return.” That is: send
humans back to the Moon.
What's that I smell? Could it be a whiff of scam?
Why do you say that? Kennedy's 'We choose to go to the Moon'
speech was given on May 25, 1961. Our first landing mission
(Surveyor 1) was June 2, 1966.
We've learned a lot about space exploration since then. I can't
see why it should take longer now than it did 50+ years ago.
It isn't a matter of time. It's a matter of money. While Bezos' ego
is at least as large as that of NASA's was in 1961, his budget is
not. Especially adjusted for inflation.

Plus, there are practical obstacles. No one in the world with
launch facilities will let his vehicles anywhere near their pads
with human beings aboard without a human rating. I doubt it's even
*possible*, with *any* budget, to get a human rating in five years.

But I suspect the only person being scammed here is Bezos, and the
person scamming him is likely himself.
--
Terry Austin

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
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