Discussion:
I need to buy comic books?
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Bill Gill
2017-02-21 14:01:56 UTC
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Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".


Bill
Don Kuenz
2017-02-21 15:48:08 UTC
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Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!

But the fact remains that some stories are only available as graphic
novels. Ellison's treatment of _The City on the Edge of Forever_ is one
such story. It's only available as a graphic novel. And it's one of my
treasures.

If you look at things philosophically it may not be so bad. They say
that each picture's worth a thousand words. And each page has lots of
pictures. Theoretically that's thousands of words per page right there.
The dialog balloons in graphic novels also tend to be packed with more
words than normal.

Thank you,

--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-21 16:53:40 UTC
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Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check
it out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic
books in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long
time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had access to
lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in them, since
they don't have all of the paper taken up with pictures.
Without the pictures they can put in words instead, and words
are much more compact, so they can get a real story in the same
place. But now I may have to see if I can find the comic
books. I think they would be in the section of the book store
marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!
But the fact remains that some stories are only available as
graphic novels. Ellison's treatment of _The City on the Edge of
Forever_ is one such story. It's only available as a graphic
novel. And it's one of my treasures.
Note: it has also been available in script form. I have a copy
somewhere.
Post by Don Kuenz
If you look at things philosophically it may not be so bad. They
say that each picture's worth a thousand words. And each page
has lots of pictures. Theoretically that's thousands of words
per page right there. The dialog balloons in graphic novels also
tend to be packed with more words than normal.
I've always objected to incomplete stories. Yeah, I do reason some
series that amount of one large story published in multiple
volumes, but I've never been especially fond of the format.

Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product in a
completely different format, however, is a deal killer for me.
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Don Kuenz
2017-02-21 20:48:30 UTC
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Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check
it out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic
books in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long
time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had access to
lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in them, since
they don't have all of the paper taken up with pictures.
Without the pictures they can put in words instead, and words
are much more compact, so they can get a real story in the same
place. But now I may have to see if I can find the comic
books. I think they would be in the section of the book store
marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!
But the fact remains that some stories are only available as
graphic novels. Ellison's treatment of _The City on the Edge of
Forever_ is one such story. It's only available as a graphic
novel. And it's one of my treasures.
Note: it has also been available in script form. I have a copy
somewhere.
Good call. ISBN 1565049640. It contains four treatments. That way Harlan
can fully air all grievances (to the delight of his audience).

The graphic novel adds interesting visuals to the story. TV shows and
movies work well in the graphic novel format.

_Serenity_ ISBN 1845760824 isn't a graphic novel in the conventional
sense. It contains a script interspersed with illustrations and
photographs.

_Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep_ ISBN 9781608865000 contains every
word of the novel. That's why it spans six volumes.

Thank you,

--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-21 20:31:23 UTC
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Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that
didn't happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line
to check it out. It seems that they have been putting out
some comic books in the series. I haven't read comic books
in a long time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had
access to lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in
them, since they don't have all of the paper taken up with
pictures. Without the pictures they can put in words instead,
and words are much more compact, so they can get a real story
in the same place. But now I may have to see if I can find
the comic books. I think they would be in the section of the
book store marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!
But the fact remains that some stories are only available as
graphic novels. Ellison's treatment of _The City on the Edge
of Forever_ is one such story. It's only available as a
graphic novel. And it's one of my treasures.
Note: it has also been available in script form. I have a copy
somewhere.
Good call. ISBN 1565049640. It contains four treatments. That
way Harlan can fully air all grievances (to the delight of his
audience).
And to the delight of Harlan. I don't think I've ever seen a man
who more enjoys being pissed off. (Or profits from it more.)
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Chrysi Cat
2017-02-22 06:37:29 UTC
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Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that
didn't happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line
to check it out. It seems that they have been putting out
some comic books in the series. I haven't read comic books
in a long time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had
access to lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in
them, since they don't have all of the paper taken up with
pictures. Without the pictures they can put in words instead,
and words are much more compact, so they can get a real story
in the same place. But now I may have to see if I can find
the comic books. I think they would be in the section of the
book store marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!
But the fact remains that some stories are only available as
graphic novels. Ellison's treatment of _The City on the Edge
of Forever_ is one such story. It's only available as a
graphic novel. And it's one of my treasures.
Note: it has also been available in script form. I have a copy
somewhere.
Good call. ISBN 1565049640. It contains four treatments. That
way Harlan can fully air all grievances (to the delight of his
audience).
And to the delight of Harlan. I don't think I've ever seen a man
who more enjoys being pissed off. (Or profits from it more.)
'Profits from it more', I'll give you.

*You* seem to enjoy it every _bit_ as much, though :-P
--
Chrysi Cat
1/2 anthrocat, nearly 1/2 anthrofox, all magical
Transgoddess, quick to anger
Call me Chrysi or call me Kat, I'll respond to either!
Robert Woodward
2017-02-22 06:28:12 UTC
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Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check
it out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic
books in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long
time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had access to
lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in them, since
they don't have all of the paper taken up with pictures.
Without the pictures they can put in words instead, and words
are much more compact, so they can get a real story in the same
place. But now I may have to see if I can find the comic
books. I think they would be in the section of the book store
marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
I've always objected to incomplete stories. Yeah, I do reason some
series that amount of one large story published in multiple
volumes, but I've never been especially fond of the format.
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product in a
completely different format, however, is a deal killer for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will say that the
first, _Body Work_ is not part of the overarching plot line. It is just
another investigation (remember the vampires in the 1st book?). The
second, _Night Witch_, could be considered part of the overarching plot
line because Leslie appears (as a complication in the background),
though there is no hint at the identity of the Faceless Man (he probably
was the voice on the phone in a couple of scenes). The third, _Black
Mould_, is unfinished, but it also appears to be just another Folly
investigation. BTW, Sahra Guleed is in the 1st and 3rd.
--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
‹-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward ***@drizzle.com
Bill Gill
2017-02-22 14:06:28 UTC
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Post by Robert Woodward
BTW, Sahra Guleed is in the 1st and 3rd.
Sahra is a full player in "The Hanging Tree."
She seems to have become the de-facto back-up
for Peter.

Bill
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-22 16:22:54 UTC
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Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that
didn't happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line
to check it out. It seems that they have been putting out
some comic books in the series. I haven't read comic books
in a long time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had
access to lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in
them, since they don't have all of the paper taken up with
pictures. Without the pictures they can put in words
instead, and words are much more compact, so they can get a
real story in the same place. But now I may have to see if
I can find the comic books. I think they would be in the
section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
I've always objected to incomplete stories. Yeah, I do reason
some series that amount of one large story published in
multiple volumes, but I've never been especially fond of the
format.
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product in
a completely different format, however, is a deal killer for
me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will say
that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the overarching plot
line. It is just another investigation (remember the vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet your
rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more boring and
overdone is zombies.
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Bill Gill
2017-02-22 19:42:50 UTC
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Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that
didn't happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line
to check it out. It seems that they have been putting out
some comic books in the series. I haven't read comic books
in a long time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had
access to lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in
them, since they don't have all of the paper taken up with
pictures. Without the pictures they can put in words
instead, and words are much more compact, so they can get a
real story in the same place. But now I may have to see if
I can find the comic books. I think they would be in the
section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
I've always objected to incomplete stories. Yeah, I do reason
some series that amount of one large story published in
multiple volumes, but I've never been especially fond of the
format.
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product in
a completely different format, however, is a deal killer for
me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will say
that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the overarching plot
line. It is just another investigation (remember the vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet your
rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more boring and
overdone is zombies.
Vampires showed up in the very first book "Midnight Riot" ( in the US
"Rivers of London" elsewhere. They were not your run of the mill
Urban Fantasy vampires. They just hung around sucking the life force
out of everything (people, animals, plants) around them. Of course
in "Moon Over Soho" there were some people who might have been
classified as vampires, but they only worked on Jazz musicians.

Bill
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-22 18:58:28 UTC
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Post by Bill Gill
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that
didn't happen in any of the previous books. So I go on
line to check it out. It seems that they have been putting
out some comic books in the series. I haven't read comic
books in a long time. I pretty much quit when I got so
that I had access to lots of real books. Real books have a
lot more in them, since they don't have all of the paper
taken up with pictures. Without the pictures they can put
in words instead, and words are much more compact, so they
can get a real story in the same place. But now I may have
to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic
novels".
Amen. You said it!
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
I've always objected to incomplete stories. Yeah, I do reason
some series that amount of one large story published in
multiple volumes, but I've never been especially fond of the
format.
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product
in a completely different format, however, is a deal killer
for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will say
that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the overarching
plot line. It is just another investigation (remember the
vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet
your rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more boring
and overdone is zombies.
Vampires showed up in the very first book "Midnight Riot" ( in
the US "Rivers of London" elsewhere.
You'll never convince me that was anything other than a crass
attempt to cash in on the fad.
Post by Bill Gill
They were not your run of
the mill Urban Fantasy vampires.
They never are. That's the overused trope.
Post by Bill Gill
They just hung around sucking
the life force out of everything (people, animals, plants)
around them. Of course in "Moon Over Soho" there were some
people who might have been classified as vampires, but they only
worked on Jazz musicians.
Like I said, the only thing more overused and boring is zombies. Is
there a story about vampires who only feed on zombies? Or vampires
being turned *into* zombies? Or zombies being turned into vampires,
who then only feed on other zombies, while said zombies turn
regular vampires into other zombies? Add in a werewolf or tow, and
it would the make the suckage so dense it turns into a black hole
that sucks in the author and destroys all traces of itself.

With glitter on top.
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Lynn McGuire
2017-02-22 23:22:40 UTC
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Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that
didn't happen in any of the previous books. So I go on
line to check it out. It seems that they have been putting
out some comic books in the series. I haven't read comic
books in a long time. I pretty much quit when I got so
that I had access to lots of real books. Real books have a
lot more in them, since they don't have all of the paper
taken up with pictures. Without the pictures they can put
in words instead, and words are much more compact, so they
can get a real story in the same place. But now I may have
to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic
novels".
Amen. You said it!
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
I've always objected to incomplete stories. Yeah, I do reason
some series that amount of one large story published in
multiple volumes, but I've never been especially fond of the
format.
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product
in a completely different format, however, is a deal killer
for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will say
that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the overarching
plot line. It is just another investigation (remember the
vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet
your rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more boring
and overdone is zombies.
Vampires showed up in the very first book "Midnight Riot" ( in
the US "Rivers of London" elsewhere.
You'll never convince me that was anything other than a crass
attempt to cash in on the fad.
Post by Bill Gill
They were not your run of
the mill Urban Fantasy vampires.
They never are. That's the overused trope.
Post by Bill Gill
They just hung around sucking
the life force out of everything (people, animals, plants)
around them. Of course in "Moon Over Soho" there were some
people who might have been classified as vampires, but they only
worked on Jazz musicians.
Like I said, the only thing more overused and boring is zombies. Is
there a story about vampires who only feed on zombies? Or vampires
being turned *into* zombies? Or zombies being turned into vampires,
who then only feed on other zombies, while said zombies turn
regular vampires into other zombies? Add in a werewolf or tow, and
it would the make the suckage so dense it turns into a black hole
that sucks in the author and destroys all traces of itself.
With glitter on top.
In "The Walking Dead", The Kingdom pays tribute to the Saviors, a rival gang, with pigs that are fed with Walkers in the hope that
the Saviors will get sick.

Lynn
Kevrob
2017-02-22 23:42:34 UTC
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Post by Lynn McGuire
In "The Walking Dead", The Kingdom pays tribute to the Saviors, a rival gang, with pigs that are fed with Walkers in the hope that
the Saviors will get sick.
TWD, BTW, started as a comic book. So did "Men In Black."

Kevin R
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-22 23:13:09 UTC
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Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben
Aaronovitch (The Hanging Tree) I find references to some
things that didn't happen in any of the previous books.
So I go on line to check it out. It seems that they have
been putting out some comic books in the series. I
haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty much
quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real
books. Real books have a lot more in them, since they
don't have all of the paper taken up with pictures.
Without the pictures they can put in words instead, and
words are much more compact, so they can get a real story
in the same place. But now I may have to see if I can
find the comic books. I think they would be in the
section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Amen. You said it!
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
I've always objected to incomplete stories. Yeah, I do
reason some series that amount of one large story published
in multiple volumes, but I've never been especially fond of
the format.
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product
in a completely different format, however, is a deal killer
for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will
say that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the
overarching plot line. It is just another investigation
(remember the vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet
your rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more
boring and overdone is zombies.
Vampires showed up in the very first book "Midnight Riot" ( in
the US "Rivers of London" elsewhere.
You'll never convince me that was anything other than a crass
attempt to cash in on the fad.
Post by Bill Gill
They were not your run of
the mill Urban Fantasy vampires.
They never are. That's the overused trope.
Post by Bill Gill
They just hung around sucking
the life force out of everything (people, animals, plants)
around them. Of course in "Moon Over Soho" there were some
people who might have been classified as vampires, but they
only worked on Jazz musicians.
Like I said, the only thing more overused and boring is
zombies. Is there a story about vampires who only feed on
zombies? Or vampires being turned *into* zombies? Or zombies
being turned into vampires, who then only feed on other
zombies, while said zombies turn regular vampires into other
zombies? Add in a werewolf or tow, and it would the make the
suckage so dense it turns into a black hole that sucks in the
author and destroys all traces of itself.
With glitter on top.
I guess for the ultimate in formulaic crapage, we need to add an
adolescent girl who is unaware that she is actually a princess with
magical powers kidnapped at birth from an alternate dimension, who
falls madly in lust with all three of the vampire/zombie/werewolf
hybrids, and can't decide which is her soulmate. For 15 volumens.

And that's one gay alien dinosaur short of being a Jack Tingle
masterpiece.
Post by Lynn McGuire
In "The Walking Dead", The Kingdom pays tribute to the Saviors,
a rival gang, with pigs that are fed with Walkers in the hope
that the Saviors will get sick.
You do nothing to convince me to watch this show, or watch or read
anything else in the genre.
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Robert Woodward
2017-02-23 05:42:45 UTC
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<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product in
a completely different format, however, is a deal killer for
me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will say
that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the overarching plot
line. It is just another investigation (remember the vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet your
rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more boring and
overdone is zombies.
The vampires were only one or two chapters in the first novel - they
were found and they were dispatched.
--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
-------------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward ***@drizzle.com
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-23 16:30:38 UTC
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Post by Robert Woodward
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product
in a completely different format, however, is a deal killer
for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will say
that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the overarching
plot line. It is just another investigation (remember the
vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet
your rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more boring
and overdone is zombies.
The vampires were only one or two chapters in the first novel -
they were found and they were dispatched.
And? You'll still never convince me that they weren't included as a
marketing tactic.
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-02-23 19:02:36 UTC
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Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another product
in a completely different format, however, is a deal killer
for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will say
that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the overarching
plot line. It is just another investigation (remember the
vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet
your rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more boring
and overdone is zombies.
The vampires were only one or two chapters in the first novel -
they were found and they were dispatched.
And? You'll still never convince me that they weren't included as a
marketing tactic.
--
Terry Austin
There's an amusing erotic duology by Elliot Kay that treats vampires
and their pretensions as they deserve:

Json's eyes flicked up toward Alex, who wasn't looking at them.
His friend gave no sign of approval or disapproval.
"They kidnapped Alex," Jason said. "Which was embarrassing enough
the first time, right? I mean, y'know, vampires. That's lamer
than Juggalos. But now it's happened to him twice, and-"
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-23 18:30:15 UTC
Reply
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another
product in a completely different format, however, is a
deal killer for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will
say that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the
overarching plot line. It is just another investigation
(remember the vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet
your rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more
boring and overdone is zombies.
The vampires were only one or two chapters in the first novel
- they were found and they were dispatched.
And? You'll still never convince me that they weren't included
as a marketing tactic.
--
Terry Austin
There's an amusing erotic duology by Elliot Kay that treats
Json's eyes flicked up toward Alex, who wasn't looking at
them. His friend gave no sign of approval or disapproval.
"They kidnapped Alex," Jason said. "Which was embarrassing
enough the first time, right? I mean, y'know, vampires.
That's lamer than Juggalos. But now it's happened to him
twice, and-"
You're still doing nothing to entice me. If I want comedy, I'll dig
out a Jeff Dunham DVD.
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Kevrob
2017-02-23 22:09:52 UTC
Reply
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Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another
product in a completely different format, however, is a
deal killer for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I will
say that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the
overarching plot line. It is just another investigation
(remember the vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can bet
your rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing more
boring and overdone is zombies.
The vampires were only one or two chapters in the first novel
- they were found and they were dispatched.
And? You'll still never convince me that they weren't included
as a marketing tactic.
--
Terry Austin
There's an amusing erotic duology by Elliot Kay that treats
Json's eyes flicked up toward Alex, who wasn't looking at
them. His friend gave no sign of approval or disapproval.
"They kidnapped Alex," Jason said. "Which was embarrassing
enough the first time, right? I mean, y'know, vampires.
That's lamer than Juggalos. But now it's happened to him
twice, and-"
You're still doing nothing to entice me. If I want comedy, I'll dig
out a Jeff Dunham DVD.
My mental image of GUCS is now merged with that of Walter.

Kevin R

http://preview.tinyurl.com/WalterGoogleImage

https://tinyurl.com/WalterGoogleImage

https://www.google.com/search?q=JEFF+DUNHAM%27S+walter&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjLp7G9nafSAhVnyVQKHZslDXkQ_AUICCgB&biw=1366&bih=610
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-24 01:21:01 UTC
Reply
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On Thursday, February 23, 2017 at 2:30:17 PM UTC-5, Gutless
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
<SNIP>
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Leaving stuff out on purpose to make me buy another
product in a completely different format, however, is a
deal killer for me.
In defense of the Rivers of London graphic novels, I
will say that the first, _Body Work_ is not part of the
overarching plot line. It is just another investigation
(remember the vampires
Well, as soon as we get to vampires being in it, you can
bet your rent I haven't read it, and won't. Only thing
more boring and overdone is zombies.
The vampires were only one or two chapters in the first
novel - they were found and they were dispatched.
And? You'll still never convince me that they weren't
included as a marketing tactic.
--
Terry Austin
There's an amusing erotic duology by Elliot Kay that treats
Json's eyes flicked up toward Alex, who wasn't looking
at them. His friend gave no sign of approval or
disapproval. "They kidnapped Alex," Jason said. "Which
was embarrassing enough the first time, right? I mean,
y'know, vampires. That's lamer than Juggalos. But now
it's happened to him twice, and-"
You're still doing nothing to entice me. If I want comedy, I'll
dig out a Jeff Dunham DVD.
My mental image of GUCS is now merged with that of Walter.
Kevin R
http://preview.tinyurl.com/WalterGoogleImage
https://tinyurl.com/WalterGoogleImage
https://www.google.com/search?q=JEFF+DUNHAM%27S+walter&source=lnm
s&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjLp7G9nafSAhVnyVQKHZslDXkQ_AUICCgB&biw
=1366&bih=610
Not an entirely unreasonable thought, though I'm not quite *that*
bald.
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
T Guy
2017-02-21 16:23:49 UTC
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Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact...
iT could be worse. There could be paintings or sculptures.
Dorothy J Heydt
2017-02-21 16:58:51 UTC
Reply
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Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact...
iT could be worse. There could be paintings or sculptures.
So there could. I just looked up Botticelli's _Calumny,_ but it
turns out to be a painting of a description of a _painting_,
originally painted in the 4th century BCE and subsequently lost.
There could be similar paintings of descriptions of lost
sculpture, but I can't think of any offhand.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calumny_of_Apelles_(Botticelli)
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Greg Goss
2017-02-22 05:21:04 UTC
Reply
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Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact...
iT could be worse. There could be paintings or sculptures.
So there could. I just looked up Botticelli's _Calumny,_ but it
turns out to be a painting of a description of a _painting_,
originally painted in the 4th century BCE and subsequently lost.
There could be similar paintings of descriptions of lost
sculpture, but I can't think of any offhand.
I'm sometimes amused when stories cross media.

Somewhere in my never-unpacked library, I have the book treatments of
both Convoy and Ode to BIlly Joe. You start with a three minute song,
then produce a movie and hire someone to do a book. In both cases,
the book and the movie don't really follow each other, even though
they were intended as cross-promotion.

When I finally watched the movie for Convoy, I was intensely
disappointed, because it was so much less than the book. Even though
both were derived from a three minute piece of pop music.

For Ode to Billy Joe, I don't remember much of the movie at all,
though I know that one key element is handled much differently than in
the book. I don't know if it was such a critical element of the
movie, but from the book, I know WHAT they threw off the bridge.
(grin)
--
We are geeks. Resistance is voltage over current.
Kevrob
2017-02-22 08:01:26 UTC
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Post by Greg Goss
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact...
iT could be worse. There could be paintings or sculptures.
So there could. I just looked up Botticelli's _Calumny,_ but it
turns out to be a painting of a description of a _painting_,
originally painted in the 4th century BCE and subsequently lost.
There could be similar paintings of descriptions of lost
sculpture, but I can't think of any offhand.
I'm sometimes amused when stories cross media.
Somewhere in my never-unpacked library, I have the book treatments of
both Convoy and Ode to BIlly Joe. You start with a three minute song,
then produce a movie and hire someone to do a book. In both cases,
the book and the movie don't really follow each other, even though
they were intended as cross-promotion.
The Convoy movie:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convoy_(1978_film)

http://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=convoy.

Ode to Billy Jo:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ode_to_Billy_Joe_(film)
Post by Greg Goss
When I finally watched the movie for Convoy, I was intensely
disappointed, because it was so much less than the book. Even though
both were derived from a three minute piece of pop music.
For Ode to Billy Joe, I don't remember much of the movie at all,
though I know that one key element is handled much differently than in
the book. I don't know if it was such a critical element of the
movie, but from the book, I know WHAT they threw off the bridge.
(grin)
The song left what that was a mystery. Robby Benson as a Surn
boy, though... He was MAYBE more believable as a basketball
prodigy (One on One.) Born in Dallas, but raised in NYC.
His Billy Joe is often thought to be one of the worst Dixie
accents on film.

I SO had a crush on Bobbie Gentry, though.

Kevin R
Greg Goss
2017-02-22 08:50:41 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Post by Greg Goss
For Ode to Billy Joe, I don't remember much of the movie at all,
though I know that one key element is handled much differently than in
the book. I don't know if it was such a critical element of the
movie, but from the book, I know WHAT they threw off the bridge.
(grin)
The song left what that was a mystery.
Basically she was discarding her childhood. Very metaphorical. (book
version).
--
We are geeks. Resistance is voltage over current.
Don Kuenz
2017-02-22 15:24:12 UTC
Reply
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Post by Greg Goss
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact...
iT could be worse. There could be paintings or sculptures.
So there could. I just looked up Botticelli's _Calumny,_ but it
turns out to be a painting of a description of a _painting_,
originally painted in the 4th century BCE and subsequently lost.
There could be similar paintings of descriptions of lost
sculpture, but I can't think of any offhand.
I'm sometimes amused when stories cross media.
Somewhere in my never-unpacked library, I have the book treatments of
both Convoy and Ode to BIlly Joe. You start with a three minute song,
then produce a movie and hire someone to do a book. In both cases,
the book and the movie don't really follow each other, even though
they were intended as cross-promotion.
When I finally watched the movie for Convoy, I was intensely
disappointed, because it was so much less than the book. Even though
both were derived from a three minute piece of pop music.
For Ode to Billy Joe, I don't remember much of the movie at all,
though I know that one key element is handled much differently than in
the book. I don't know if it was such a critical element of the
movie, but from the book, I know WHAT they threw off the bridge.
(grin)
_Science-Fiction Classics - The Stories That Morphed Into Movies_
(Ackerman) is being slowly read by me. It's a cross media experience
that includes both reading the story and watching the movie.

"Dr Cyclops" (Kutner) was the first new story and movie for me. At a
gross level, without the benefit of a detailed analysis, it seems that
every line of dialog that appears in the print story is also used in the
movie "as is." Although the movie adds a few extra scenes with new
dialog here and there.

The first TV treatment of _The Lathe of Heaven_ (Le Guin) also closely
follows Le Guin's print story. The second TV treatment takes liberties
with the story.

That's the best experience for me. A first treatment that tells the
story exactly as it appears in print, followed by later treatments that
take liberties with the story.

Thank you,

--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-21 16:53:57 UTC
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Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check
it out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic
books in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long
time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had access to
lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in them, since
they don't have all of the paper taken up with pictures.
Without the pictures they can put in words instead, and words
are much more compact...
iT could be worse. There could be paintings or sculptures.
Or live stage performances.
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-02-21 17:32:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
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Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Butcher does canonical Dresden comics -- but so far they haven't debuted
any charcters or established any events that you will "miss" if you have
just been following the books.

Nowdays in Urban Fantasy, there are a lot of loss-leader novellettes and
short stories that come out in random anthologies and feature the authors'
lead characters. Usually this is OK, but Kim Harrison had a really
irritating case where she debuted an important chracter somewhere that
most people following the books had never heard of much less read..
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Steve Coltrin
2017-02-21 19:16:22 UTC
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begin fnord
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Nowdays in Urban Fantasy, there are a lot of loss-leader novellettes and
short stories that come out in random anthologies and feature the authors'
lead characters. Usually this is OK, but Kim Harrison had a really
irritating case where she debuted an important chracter somewhere that
most people following the books had never heard of much less read..
It's not just UF. The last Horror Herringbone book I picked up, I
who the hell are these peopled a couple of characters who, it turned
out, were refugees from some anthology I had had no interest in reading.
And that was a while ago.
--
Steve Coltrin ***@omcl.org Google Groups killfiled here
"A group known as the League of Human Dignity helped arrange for Deuel
to be driven to a local livestock scale, where he could be weighed."
- Associated Press
Greg Goss
2017-02-22 05:22:09 UTC
Reply
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Nowdays in Urban Fantasy, there are a lot of loss-leader novellettes and
short stories that come out in random anthologies and feature the authors'
lead characters. Usually this is OK, but Kim Harrison had a really
irritating case where she debuted an important chracter somewhere that
most people following the books had never heard of much less read..
Not just in fantasy. The back-story for the Star Trek reboot came out
in comic form as part of the promotional sequence for the movie.
--
We are geeks. Resistance is voltage over current.
Robert Carnegie
2017-02-21 19:57:19 UTC
Reply
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Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
There's an e-graphic edition, or whatever that
is called, $8.99 for the first book, at
<https://www.comixology.com/>

Author's blog:
<http://temporarilysignificant.blogspot.co.uk>

Author's web site listed elsewhere as
www.the-folly.com but not appearing to me as I type.
Bill Gill
2017-02-22 19:44:54 UTC
Reply
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Raw Message
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.

Bill
Bill Gill
2017-02-22 23:31:51 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.

One odd thing: The story starts with what's her name, the
Russian night witch, being transported in a van with other
female offenders. That is clearly not a thing that would
happen. Nightingale is the only person they have in England
who could control her. Being transported as an ordinary
prisoner is just not in it.

Bill
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
2017-02-22 23:14:28 UTC
Reply
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Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that
didn't happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line
to check it out. It seems that they have been putting out
some comic books in the series. I haven't read comic books in
a long time. I pretty much quit when I got so that I had
access to lots of real books. Real books have a lot more in
them, since they don't have all of the paper taken up with
pictures. Without the pictures they can put in words instead,
and words are much more compact, so they can get a real story
in the same place. But now I may have to see if I can find
the comic books. I think they would be in the section of the
book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
One odd thing: The story starts with what's her name, the
Russian night witch, being transported in a van with other
female offenders. That is clearly not a thing that would
happen. Nightingale is the only person they have in England
who could control her. Being transported as an ordinary
prisoner is just not in it.
Virtually all action based fiction starts with the premise that the
heros are drooling idiots, because if they weren't, the entire
story would be about three paragraphs long. (And the villains are
too, for the same reason.)
--
Terry Austin

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
T Guy
2017-02-24 14:39:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Or maybe just be more selective, perhaps restricting yourself to ones written by either Jack Kirby or Robert Kanigher.
Lawrence Watt-Evans
2017-02-24 16:32:46 UTC
Reply
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On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 06:39:23 -0800 (PST), T Guy
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Or maybe just be more selective, perhaps restricting yourself to ones written by either Jack Kirby or Robert Kanigher.
Not to fault Kirby or Kanigher (though both had some odd quirks in
their writing), but they've both been dead a long time now, and
weren't exactly considered the top of the field as writers even when
they were alive. In the 1970s I would expect to spend ten to fifteen
minutes on a comic scripted by, say, Denny O'Neill, but only needed
five to eight for a Kirby issue of Captain America.

From bygone eras you might also consider Al Feldstein, C.C. Beck,
Alfred Bester, Gardner Fox, and John Broome, and for the current
century look at Neil Gaiman, Mark Waid, Kurt Busiek, etc.

(Alan Moore can be brilliant and readable, too, but he isn't always.
Stan Lee depended who he was working with as the artist, and how much
attention he was paying.)
--
My webpage is at http://www.watt-evans.com
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-02-24 17:30:48 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 06:39:23 -0800 (PST), T Guy
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Or maybe just be more selective, perhaps restricting yourself to ones
written by either Jack Kirby or Robert Kanigher.
Not to fault Kirby or Kanigher (though both had some odd quirks in
their writing), but they've both been dead a long time now, and
weren't exactly considered the top of the field as writers even when
they were alive. In the 1970s I would expect to spend ten to fifteen
minutes on a comic scripted by, say, Denny O'Neill, but only needed
five to eight for a Kirby issue of Captain America.
Kirby could tell a story visually, but he couldn't write. His dialogue was
awful. That's not a knock on him; it's just that his stories worked better
with someone else doing the "words" part.
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
T Guy
2017-02-24 18:08:50 UTC
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 06:39:23 -0800 (PST), T Guy
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Or maybe just be more selective, perhaps restricting yourself to ones
written by either Jack Kirby or Robert Kanigher.
Not to fault Kirby or Kanigher (though both had some odd quirks in
their writing), but they've both been dead a long time now, and
weren't exactly considered the top of the field as writers even when
they were alive. In the 1970s I would expect to spend ten to fifteen
minutes on a comic scripted by, say, Denny O'Neill, but only needed
five to eight for a Kirby issue of Captain America.
Kirby could tell a story visually, but he couldn't write. His dialogue was
awful. That's not a knock on him; it's just that his stories worked better
with someone else doing the "words" part.
Well, I suppose you're entitled to your opinion, but I disagree with it. There are few , if, indeed, any, comics writers whose words I prefer.
David Goldfarb
2017-02-25 00:32:54 UTC
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Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Kirby could tell a story visually, but he couldn't write. His dialogue was
awful. That's not a knock on him; it's just that his stories worked better
with someone else doing the "words" part.
A while back DC reprinted Kirby's original Fourth World stuff. At the
back of the Jimmy Olsen collection, there was a Newsboy Legion story
not written by Kirby, tying up a loose end. "Wow," I thought to myself,
"Albano and Bridwell are distinguishing Big Words from the other boys
by his speech patterns! What a concept!"
--
David Goldfarb | "Boom. Sooner or later. Boom!"
***@gmail.com |
***@ocf.berkeley.edu | -- Babylon 5, "Grail"
Kevrob
2017-02-25 02:45:08 UTC
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Post by David Goldfarb
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Kirby could tell a story visually, but he couldn't write. His dialogue was
awful. That's not a knock on him; it's just that his stories worked better
with someone else doing the "words" part.
A while back DC reprinted Kirby's original Fourth World stuff. At the
back of the Jimmy Olsen collection, there was a Newsboy Legion story
not written by Kirby, tying up a loose end. "Wow," I thought to myself,
"Albano and Bridwell are distinguishing Big Words from the other boys
by his speech patterns! What a concept!"
Well, I'll be super-amalgamated!

That's the way Big Words talked in the original NL & the Guardian
stories from STAR-SPANGLED COMICS DC reprinted in the 1970s
SPJO issues Kirby wrote and drew. He was a 12-year-old version
of William Harper Littlejohn.

Kevin R
Kevrob
2017-02-24 18:46:02 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 06:39:23 -0800 (PST), T Guy
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Or maybe just be more selective, perhaps restricting yourself to ones written by either Jack Kirby or Robert Kanigher.
Not to fault Kirby or Kanigher (though both had some odd quirks in
their writing), but they've both been dead a long time now, and
weren't exactly considered the top of the field as writers even when
they were alive. In the 1970s I would expect to spend ten to fifteen
minutes on a comic scripted by, say, Denny O'Neill, but only needed
five to eight for a Kirby issue of Captain America.
Kirby was a tremendous plotter. His problem was that his scripting
wasn't always up to par. Stan Lee gets a lot of credit for "writing"
many of the "Lee/Kirby" classics (Fantastic Four and the other Marvel
series of the 1960s) but in many cases, especially in the middle of an
over 100-issue run, Stan was only adding dialogue to already-drawn pages.
Same for the Lee/Steve Ditko "Spider-Man" stories.

For a great example of Jack's writing chops, I recommend "The Glory
Boat" in NEW GODS #6:

https://www.comics.org/issue/24692/cover/4/

http://geoffklock.blogspot.com/2009/07/jack-kirbys-new-gods-6.html

NG #7, "The Pact" kicks ass, too.

https://www.comics.org/issue/24859/cover/4/

http://geoffklock.blogspot.com/2009/08/new-gods-7.html
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
From bygone eras you might also consider Al Feldstein, C.C. Beck,
Oh, no. Bill Parker, Otto Binder - they wrote Captain Marvel.
Beck drew it, and he was great at it, but Binder was the champ.
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Alfred Bester, Gardner Fox, and John Broome, and for the current
century look at Neil Gaiman, Mark Waid, Kurt Busiek, etc.
(Alan Moore can be brilliant and readable, too, but he isn't always.
Stan Lee depended who he was working with as the artist, and how much
attention he was paying.)
Kevin R
Lawrence Watt-Evans
2017-02-24 19:32:24 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 06:39:23 -0800 (PST), T Guy
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Or maybe just be more selective, perhaps restricting yourself to ones written by either Jack Kirby or Robert Kanigher.
Not to fault Kirby or Kanigher (though both had some odd quirks in
their writing), but they've both been dead a long time now, and
weren't exactly considered the top of the field as writers even when
they were alive. In the 1970s I would expect to spend ten to fifteen
minutes on a comic scripted by, say, Denny O'Neill, but only needed
five to eight for a Kirby issue of Captain America.
Kirby was a tremendous plotter. His problem was that his scripting
wasn't always up to par. Stan Lee gets a lot of credit for "writing"
many of the "Lee/Kirby" classics (Fantastic Four and the other Marvel
series of the 1960s) but in many cases, especially in the middle of an
over 100-issue run, Stan was only adding dialogue to already-drawn pages.
Same for the Lee/Steve Ditko "Spider-Man" stories.
Yup.

Kirby was also big on letting the visuals carry the story, so when he
was given a free hand you'd have two-page spreads, multiple splash
pages -- which were very cool, but you can't really call them
"writing," exactly, and the story would go really fast.
Post by Kevrob
For a great example of Jack's writing chops, I recommend "The Glory
https://www.comics.org/issue/24692/cover/4/
http://geoffklock.blogspot.com/2009/07/jack-kirbys-new-gods-6.html
NG #7, "The Pact" kicks ass, too.
https://www.comics.org/issue/24859/cover/4/
http://geoffklock.blogspot.com/2009/08/new-gods-7.html
NEW GODS was probably the best scripting Kirby ever did, and I
sometimes wonder whether an editor did some serious revision on it.
Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
From bygone eras you might also consider Al Feldstein, C.C. Beck,
Oh, no. Bill Parker, Otto Binder - they wrote Captain Marvel.
Beck drew it, and he was great at it, but Binder was the champ.
You're right; brain cramp. Sorry.
--
My webpage is at http://www.watt-evans.com
Kevrob
2017-02-24 21:11:47 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 06:39:23 -0800 (PST), T Guy
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Or maybe just be more selective, perhaps restricting yourself to ones written by either Jack Kirby or Robert Kanigher.
Not to fault Kirby or Kanigher (though both had some odd quirks in
their writing), but they've both been dead a long time now, and
weren't exactly considered the top of the field as writers even when
they were alive. In the 1970s I would expect to spend ten to fifteen
minutes on a comic scripted by, say, Denny O'Neill, but only needed
five to eight for a Kirby issue of Captain America.
Kirby was a tremendous plotter. His problem was that his scripting
wasn't always up to par. Stan Lee gets a lot of credit for "writing"
many of the "Lee/Kirby" classics (Fantastic Four and the other Marvel
series of the 1960s) but in many cases, especially in the middle of an
over 100-issue run, Stan was only adding dialogue to already-drawn pages.
Same for the Lee/Steve Ditko "Spider-Man" stories.
Yup.
Kirby was also big on letting the visuals carry the story, so when he
was given a free hand you'd have two-page spreads, multiple splash
pages -- which were very cool, but you can't really call them
"writing," exactly, and the story would go really fast.
Grammar school me felt the very same about early 60s Marvels. It took
me a while to scrape together 12 cents or a quarter for a standard
comic or a "giant." I thought Lee/Kirby were "padding" their stories,
for the longest time. At the same time. Lee/Ditko packed a lot of story
into even tinier panels than the Weisinger-edited Superman titles or the
Schwartz-edited DCs did. (FLASH, GREEN LANTERN, ATOM, HAWKMAN,
JUSTICE LEAGUE, DC's SF books and eventually the Batman titles.)

Teenage me, however, finally "got" Kirby, a little too late to be a
Permanent Marvelite Maximus. I bought the 4th World comics off the
newsstand, when I could find them. It took me forever to find
NEW GODS #2. When I was a pre-teen, most of the Marvels I read I
didn't buy. The local barber shop had them by the ton, along with DCs
and Archies and others. I could read through quite a stack while
waiting for a chair to open up. I have three brothers, and getting 5
heads cut could take some time - time to read comics!
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Post by Kevrob
For a great example of Jack's writing chops, I recommend "The Glory
https://www.comics.org/issue/24692/cover/4/
http://geoffklock.blogspot.com/2009/07/jack-kirbys-new-gods-6.html
NG #7, "The Pact" kicks ass, too.
https://www.comics.org/issue/24859/cover/4/
http://geoffklock.blogspot.com/2009/08/new-gods-7.html
NEW GODS was probably the best scripting Kirby ever did, and I
sometimes wonder whether an editor did some serious revision on it.
Some of THE ETERNALS, a nor dissimilar book, was pretty good,
too.

Working out of California, he had a very young, Mark Evanier and,
IMS, Steve Skeates working for him as assistants. I don't think
they ever take credit for anything more than putting the letter
columns together and maybe helping to pick the vintage Simon/Kirby
reprints that filled out the back pages of the 52-page/25 cent
Fourth World books.
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
From bygone eras you might also consider Al Feldstein, C.C. Beck,
Oh, no. Bill Parker, Otto Binder - they wrote Captain Marvel.
Beck drew it, and he was great at it, but Binder was the champ.
You're right; brain cramp. Sorry.
Let's not forget some of the other great comics writers:
Will (THE SPIRIT) Eisner, Carl Barks and his Disney Ducks,
and the oft-forgotten, but highly entertaining John (LITTLE
LULU) Stanley. I'm also a big fan of Sheldon "Shelly" Mayer,
for his "Scribbly" and "SUGAR AND SPIKE."

Kevin R
Lawrence Watt-Evans
2017-02-24 21:39:36 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Kirby was also big on letting the visuals carry the story, so when he
was given a free hand you'd have two-page spreads, multiple splash
pages -- which were very cool, but you can't really call them
"writing," exactly, and the story would go really fast.
Grammar school me felt the very same about early 60s Marvels. It took
me a while to scrape together 12 cents or a quarter for a standard
comic or a "giant." I thought Lee/Kirby were "padding" their stories,
for the longest time. At the same time. Lee/Ditko packed a lot of story
into even tinier panels than the Weisinger-edited Superman titles or the
Schwartz-edited DCs did. (FLASH, GREEN LANTERN, ATOM, HAWKMAN,
JUSTICE LEAGUE, DC's SF books and eventually the Batman titles.)
I simply didn't have access to the Lee/Kirby titles back then -- there
wasn't anywhere within walking distance that sold new Marvels. The
drug store carried Archie and Harvey stuff, and the second-hand
bookstore (where I got most of my comics for a nickel apiece) had lots
of Dell, Gold Key, DC, ACG, etc. but only rarely got any Marvels.

The local barber shop didn't have any comics. Very annoying; I heard
about barber shops with comics, but never saw one. I think all the
comics got swiped, so they stopped buying them.

When I finally did get hold of Kirby's work, starting in 1969 or so, I
"got" it pretty well -- but it still read really fast, even if I'd
then go back and admire the big splashy stuff.
Post by Kevrob
Teenage me, however, finally "got" Kirby, a little too late to be a
Permanent Marvelite Maximus. I bought the 4th World comics off the
newsstand, when I could find them. It took me forever to find
NEW GODS #2. When I was a pre-teen, most of the Marvels I read I
didn't buy. The local barber shop had them by the ton, along with DCs
and Archies and others. I could read through quite a stack while
waiting for a chair to open up. I have three brothers, and getting 5
heads cut could take some time - time to read comics!
I only had one brother. And the barber shop didn't have comics.
Post by Kevrob
Will (THE SPIRIT) Eisner, Carl Barks and his Disney Ducks,
and the oft-forgotten, but highly entertaining John (LITTLE
LULU) Stanley. I'm also a big fan of Sheldon "Shelly" Mayer,
for his "Scribbly" and "SUGAR AND SPIKE."
I loved SUGAR AND SPIKE, but never really cared for any of Mayer's
other work.

John Stanley was amazing -- did you ever read the stuff he wrote for
the earliest issues of GHOST STORIES? Really, really creepy, and
completely different from his brilliant Lulu and Tubby stories.

Barks and Eisner, yeah. I think Barks is one of the many influences
on my Tom Derringer series.
--
My webpage is at http://www.watt-evans.com
Kevrob
2017-02-24 23:33:33 UTC
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Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Kirby was also big on letting the visuals carry the story, so when he
was given a free hand you'd have two-page spreads, multiple splash
pages -- which were very cool, but you can't really call them
"writing," exactly, and the story would go really fast.
Grammar school me felt the very same about early 60s Marvels. It took
me a while to scrape together 12 cents or a quarter for a standard
comic or a "giant." I thought Lee/Kirby were "padding" their stories,
for the longest time. At the same time. Lee/Ditko packed a lot of story
into even tinier panels than the Weisinger-edited Superman titles or the
Schwartz-edited DCs did. (FLASH, GREEN LANTERN, ATOM, HAWKMAN,
JUSTICE LEAGUE, DC's SF books and eventually the Batman titles.)
I simply didn't have access to the Lee/Kirby titles back then -- there
wasn't anywhere within walking distance that sold new Marvels. The
drug store carried Archie and Harvey stuff, and the second-hand
bookstore (where I got most of my comics for a nickel apiece) had lots
of Dell, Gold Key, DC, ACG, etc. but only rarely got any Marvels.
If I walked home from school, I passed a pharmacy that sold Marvels,
and the barber shop was right up the street. Larry's Barber Shop.
Closed Wednesdays.

Larry could easily pop down to the Rx, and buy a stack of comics.
He also had Sports Illustrated, Sport, The Police Gazette,* and
assorted mags guys liked on hunting and fishing, and all the
major NYC/LI area newspapers. In those days, not having stuff like
that might have tempted customers to try the competition.
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
The local barber shop didn't have any comics. Very annoying; I heard
about barber shops with comics, but never saw one. I think all the
comics got swiped, so they stopped buying them.
When I finally did get hold of Kirby's work, starting in 1969 or so, I
"got" it pretty well -- but it still read really fast, even if I'd
then go back and admire the big splashy stuff.
Post by Kevrob
Teenage me, however, finally "got" Kirby, a little too late to be a
Permanent Marvelite Maximus. I bought the 4th World comics off the
newsstand, when I could find them. It took me forever to find
NEW GODS #2. When I was a pre-teen, most of the Marvels I read I
didn't buy. The local barber shop had them by the ton, along with DCs
and Archies and others. I could read through quite a stack while
waiting for a chair to open up. I have three brothers, and getting 5
heads cut could take some time - time to read comics!
I only had one brother. And the barber shop didn't have comics.
There were days I would have gladly lent you a spare one or two. :)

When longer hair became the vogue, I was torn: trying to avoid
haircuts as long as possible meant not getting to read comics
for free! Of course, by the time I started caring what girls
thought of my haircut, I was earning my own pocket money from
various odd jobs: lawn mowing and snow shoveling among them.
I was buying my comics.
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Post by Kevrob
Will (THE SPIRIT) Eisner, Carl Barks and his Disney Ducks,
and the oft-forgotten, but highly entertaining John (LITTLE
LULU) Stanley. I'm also a big fan of Sheldon "Shelly" Mayer,
for his "Scribbly" and "SUGAR AND SPIKE."
I loved SUGAR AND SPIKE, but never really cared for any of Mayer's
other work.
The early Scribblys in All-American Comics are a stitch. I haven't
read his earlier appearances. Scibbly Jibbet emerged in Dell's
POPULAR COMICS #6, July 1936, surrounded by newspaper strip stars.
He migrated to AA, DC's sister company, when Max Gaines became
an editor there.

https://www.comics.org/issue/120/cover/4/

http://www.toonopedia.com/scribbly.htm

Here's a long Scribbly story, from hiw own 1940s book.

http://johnglenntaylor.blogspot.com/2009/09/wow-complete-22-page-scribbly-story-by.html
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
John Stanley was amazing -- did you ever read the stuff he wrote for
the earliest issues of GHOST STORIES? Really, really creepy, and
completely different from his brilliant Lulu and Tubby stories.
No. I knew he wrote them, something I learned long after they were
published. I never shelled out for Dells, or later Gold Key. I did
read the occasional MAGNUS, ROBOT FIGHTER or DR SOLAR. The W T Grant
in my town, (or was it the Woolworths?) had a Gold Key only rack,
probably supplied by the Whitman distribution system that brought them
Golden Books, the coloring books and games all created by Western
Publishing. I kept up with Dell/Gold Key, there, until I was
shooed along.

This fellow, Frank Young, posted some interesting stuff about GHOST STORIES:

http://stanleystories.blogspot.com/2008/10/nuttiness-of-stanleys-ghost-stories-two.html

http://stanleystories.blogspot.com/2008/10/nuttiness-of-stanleys-ghost-stories-two.html

DELL didn't join the comics code, so when they decided to do horror or
"mystery," as the cleaned-up, post-code version was known, they may have
been able to be a bit creepier than the CMAA member houses.
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
Barks and Eisner, yeah. I think Barks is one of the many influences
on my Tom Derringer series.
Kevin R
Kevrob
2017-02-24 23:49:04 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Larry could easily pop down to the Rx, and buy a stack of comics.
He also had.... The Police Gazette,*....
Forgot my "*"

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Police_Gazette

If I ever had tried to read that at Larry's, my Dad would
have asked to borrow his razor strop!

Kevin R
Don Kuenz
2017-02-25 01:10:29 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
Larry could easily pop down to the Rx, and buy a stack of comics.
He also had.... The Police Gazette,*....
Forgot my "*"
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Police_Gazette
If I ever had tried to read that at Larry's, my Dad would
have asked to borrow his razor strop!
Speaking of police, _White Jazz_ (Ellroy) will soon be acquired by me to
read. Speaking of Carl Barks, Uncle $crooge in _The Dream of a Lifetime_

https://web.archive.org/web/20120518065428/http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Rosa/show.php?num=1&loc=D2002-033&s=date

gets mentioned by me from time to time. Because some people say that the
_Inception_ movie rips off the comic.

https://www.comicbookmovie.com/other/is-chris-nolans-mind-the-scene-of-the-crime-inception/scrooge-mcduck-a21055

Speaking of police and Marvel, here's a new scandal:

Chief Removes "Punisher" Emblem, 'Blue Lives Matter' From Police Cars After Public Reacts
https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1554041

Thank you,

--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
Robert Carnegie
2017-02-25 08:44:28 UTC
Reply
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Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
Larry could easily pop down to the Rx, and buy a stack of comics.
He also had.... The Police Gazette,*....
Forgot my "*"
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Police_Gazette
If I ever had tried to read that at Larry's, my Dad would
have asked to borrow his razor strop!
Speaking of police, _White Jazz_ (Ellroy) will soon be acquired by me to
read. Speaking of Carl Barks, Uncle $crooge in _The Dream of a Lifetime_
https://web.archive.org/web/20120518065428/http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Rosa/show.php?num=1&loc=D2002-033&s=date
gets mentioned by me from time to time. Because some people say that the
_Inception_ movie rips off the comic.
https://www.comicbookmovie.com/other/is-chris-nolans-mind-the-scene-of-the-crime-inception/scrooge-mcduck-a21055
Chief Removes "Punisher" Emblem, 'Blue Lives Matter' From Police Cars After Public Reacts
https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1554041
"Putting our lives before yours, every day.
You think we're nuts or something?"

Elsewhere, elsewhen -

"Hans - have you noticed that our caps have
actually got little pictures of skulls on them?
Hans - are we the baddies?"
- unidentified S.S. officer (looks like
David Mitchell, not the science fiction writer)
Jaimie Vandenbergh
2017-02-25 10:04:14 UTC
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On Sat, 25 Feb 2017 00:44:28 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by Don Kuenz
Chief Removes "Punisher" Emblem, 'Blue Lives Matter' From Police Cars After Public Reacts
https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1554041
"Putting our lives before yours, every day.
You think we're nuts or something?"
Elsewhere, elsewhen -
"Hans - have you noticed that our caps have
actually got little pictures of skulls on them?
Hans - are we the baddies?"
- unidentified S.S. officer (looks like
David Mitchell, not the science fiction writer)
Indeed he is. Full sketch at


Cheers - Jaimie
--
Remember, if something is on the news that means it's rare
enough that you shouldn't worry about it. It's the things
that _don't_ make the news due to being so common that you
should worry about. -- Stephen Sprunk
David Johnston
2017-02-25 18:16:04 UTC
Reply
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Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
Larry could easily pop down to the Rx, and buy a stack of comics.
He also had.... The Police Gazette,*....
Forgot my "*"
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Police_Gazette
If I ever had tried to read that at Larry's, my Dad would
have asked to borrow his razor strop!
Speaking of police, _White Jazz_ (Ellroy) will soon be acquired by me to
read. Speaking of Carl Barks, Uncle $crooge in _The Dream of a Lifetime_
https://web.archive.org/web/20120518065428/http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Rosa/show.php?num=1&loc=D2002-033&s=date
gets mentioned by me from time to time. Because some people say that the
_Inception_ movie rips off the comic.
https://www.comicbookmovie.com/other/is-chris-nolans-mind-the-scene-of-the-crime-inception/scrooge-mcduck-a21055
Chief Removes "Punisher" Emblem, 'Blue Lives Matter' From Police Cars After Public Reacts
https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1554041
Thank you,
--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
The logo did look cool. But of course in a threatening "we are the
minions of evil" way.
Kevrob
2017-02-25 20:57:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by David Johnston
Post by Don Kuenz
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
Larry could easily pop down to the Rx, and buy a stack of comics.
He also had.... The Police Gazette,*....
Forgot my "*"
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Police_Gazette
If I ever had tried to read that at Larry's, my Dad would
have asked to borrow his razor strop!
Speaking of police, _White Jazz_ (Ellroy) will soon be acquired by me to
read. Speaking of Carl Barks, Uncle $crooge in _The Dream of a Lifetime_
https://web.archive.org/web/20120518065428/http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Rosa/show.php?num=1&loc=D2002-033&s=date
gets mentioned by me from time to time. Because some people say that the
_Inception_ movie rips off the comic.
https://www.comicbookmovie.com/other/is-chris-nolans-mind-the-scene-of-the-crime-inception/scrooge-mcduck-a21055
Chief Removes "Punisher" Emblem, 'Blue Lives Matter' From Police Cars After Public Reacts
https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1554041
Thank you,
--
Don Kuenz KB7RPU
The logo did look cool. But of course in a threatening "we are the
minions of evil" way.
The "original"* Punisher logo had no stars nor stripes.

https://www.comics.org/issue/27163/cover/4/

Kevin R

* For values of original, which include stealing everything
but the costume from Don Pendleton's Mack (THE EXECUTIONER) Bolan,
while the threads and the symbol remind one of Lee Falk's "The
Phantom" and the comic books' "The Black Terror."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Terror
Lawrence Watt-Evans
2017-02-25 06:39:08 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
I simply didn't have access to the Lee/Kirby titles back then -- there
wasn't anywhere within walking distance that sold new Marvels. The
drug store carried Archie and Harvey stuff, and the second-hand
bookstore (where I got most of my comics for a nickel apiece) had lots
of Dell, Gold Key, DC, ACG, etc. but only rarely got any Marvels.
If I walked home from school, I passed a pharmacy that sold Marvels,
and the barber shop was right up the street. Larry's Barber Shop.
Closed Wednesdays.
Larry could easily pop down to the Rx, and buy a stack of comics.
He also had Sports Illustrated, Sport, The Police Gazette,* and
assorted mags guys liked on hunting and fishing, and all the
major NYC/LI area newspapers. In those days, not having stuff like
that might have tempted customers to try the competition.
Our barber (called The Town Barber) didn't HAVE any competition that I
could see; his shop was at pretty much the exact center of town, and
there weren't any others unless you went to one of the surrounding
towns.

When one opened at the shopping center a mile away, our guy promptly
went out of business.
Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
I only had one brother. And the barber shop didn't have comics.
There were days I would have gladly lent you a spare one or two. :)
Oh, I had four sisters, which probably made up for it.
Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
I loved SUGAR AND SPIKE, but never really cared for any of Mayer's
other work.
The early Scribblys in All-American Comics are a stitch. I haven't
read his earlier appearances. Scibbly Jibbet emerged in Dell's
POPULAR COMICS #6, July 1936, surrounded by newspaper strip stars.
He migrated to AA, DC's sister company, when Max Gaines became
an editor there.
https://www.comics.org/issue/120/cover/4/
http://www.toonopedia.com/scribbly.htm
Here's a long Scribbly story, from hiw own 1940s book.
http://johnglenntaylor.blogspot.com/2009/09/wow-complete-22-page-scribbly-story-by.html
That's fun, but I don't think it's anywhere near as good as SUGAR AND
SPIKE.
Post by Kevrob
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
John Stanley was amazing -- did you ever read the stuff he wrote for
the earliest issues of GHOST STORIES? Really, really creepy, and
completely different from his brilliant Lulu and Tubby stories.
No. I knew he wrote them, something I learned long after they were
published. I never shelled out for Dells, or later Gold Key. I did
read the occasional MAGNUS, ROBOT FIGHTER or DR SOLAR. The W T Grant
in my town, (or was it the Woolworths?) had a Gold Key only rack,
probably supplied by the Whitman distribution system that brought them
Golden Books, the coloring books and games all created by Western
Publishing. I kept up with Dell/Gold Key, there, until I was
shooed along.
If it was like our town, it was W.T. Grant.
Post by Kevrob
http://stanleystories.blogspot.com/2008/10/nuttiness-of-stanleys-ghost-stories-two.html
http://stanleystories.blogspot.com/2008/10/nuttiness-of-stanleys-ghost-stories-two.html
I don't really agree with him -- yes, the stories ARE like nightmares,
not traditional narratives, and that's why I like them so much.
Post by Kevrob
DELL didn't join the comics code, so when they decided to do horror or
"mystery," as the cleaned-up, post-code version was known, they may have
been able to be a bit creepier than the CMAA member houses.
That's certainly how it looked to me.
--
My webpage is at http://www.watt-evans.com
Jerry Brown
2017-02-25 09:06:42 UTC
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On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 13:11:47 -0800 (PST), Kevrob <***@my-deja.com>
wrote:

<snip>
Post by Kevrob
I have three brothers, and getting 5
heads cut could take some time - time to read comics!
Was one of your brothers named Zaphod?
--
Jerry Brown

A cat may look at a king
(but probably won't bother)
Kevrob
2017-02-25 14:00:15 UTC
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Post by Jerry Brown
<snip>
Post by Kevrob
I have three brothers, and getting 5
heads cut could take some time - time to read comics!
Was one of your brothers named Zaphod?
My head, my 3 brothers, and my father's made 5.

I pitied my poor mother, when she took all 5 of my
sister's to Mr Esposito's* for their hair appointments.
We guys could be a might unruly, but we didn't mind the
barber's shop, unless there was somewhere else we felt
we would really rather be. And a "bad haircut" when
you were a pre-teen boy in the 60s was quickly outgrown.
To some eyes, they were all bad haircuts.

My sisters could be reduced to tears if their hair
wound up looking a smidgen unlike the prototype picture
of whichever movie starlet they wanted to look like.
With 5 of them, they tended to distribute themselves
on a scale from "Mom wants me to get my hair done
for Easter, so let's get this over with so I can get
back to playing softball" to "Getting my coiffure right
is the most important thing in the multiverse."**

Kevin R

* I remember Mr E's name, because his daughter was in my class
at school, and was the consensus "hottest girl" in said class,
when we were 12-13 years old. Her long, blond hair was always
perfect. I did not fancy her on anything other than the physical
level, as a bag of wet sand had more smarts than Miss E, and she
did not have any compensatory sweetness nor kindness to the less
physically favored. [Imagine a stupid "Regina George."]

**My sister overly concerned about her hair probably was blissfully
ignorant of the possibility that alternate universes might exist.
A good thing too, if, on Earth-237b, her counterpart had better
hair, she'd just have 1 more thing to cry about!
David DeLaney
2017-02-26 09:35:46 UTC
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Post by Kevrob
I'm also a big fan of Sheldon "Shelly" Mayer,
for his "Scribbly" and "SUGAR AND SPIKE."
Apropos de nada, I note that within the last couple years the latter pair have
returned to the DC Universe, as a pair of detectives affiliated with the cape
community. It was quite moving, in a way.

Dave, way too much of my brane is taken up with tracking the unreal worlds
--
\/David DeLaney posting thru EarthLink - "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
gatekeeper.vic.com/~dbd - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Cryptoengineer
2017-02-26 16:37:22 UTC
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Post by David DeLaney
Post by Kevrob
I'm also a big fan of Sheldon "Shelly" Mayer,
for his "Scribbly" and "SUGAR AND SPIKE."
Apropos de nada, I note that within the last couple years the latter
pair have returned to the DC Universe, as a pair of detectives
affiliated with the cape community. It was quite moving, in a way.
Dave, way too much of my brane is taken up with tracking the unreal worlds
Boggle.

Its like a much more SFW version of 'Weapon Brown'.

pt

David Johnston
2017-02-24 18:44:28 UTC
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Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Or maybe just be more selective, perhaps restricting yourself to ones written by either Jack Kirby or Robert Kanigher.
Ah yes, comics written by Jack Kirby. Once he reads about Paranex the
Fighting Fetus he'll have a whole new perspective on comics.
T Guy
2017-02-24 14:40:49 UTC
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Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Same as books, i. e. prose fiction: top to bottom, left to right.

For the purposes of this message, manga don't count as comicbooks.
David Goldfarb
2017-02-25 00:20:14 UTC
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Post by T Guy
Same as books, i. e. prose fiction: top to bottom, left to right.
For the purposes of this message, manga don't count as comicbooks.
The key thing to note when reading manga is that the *primary*
direction is top-to-bottom. In a Western comic, if you're not
sure which way to go next, you go right; in manga, you go down
instead. Most translated manga has art mirror-reversed so that
the secondary direction is a more familiar left-to-right; if your
manga hasn't had that happen, then you go right-to-left instead.

(There's a translated manga based on the Sherlock tv series, where
they didn't just not flip the art, they kept the word balloon
directions also going right-to-left, so you had to go right-to-left
inside of single panels. Threw me for a loop till I figured it out.)
--
David Goldfarb | "Life is a simile."
***@gmail.com |
***@ocf.berkeley.edu | -- Terry Carr
Bill Gill
2017-02-25 14:10:35 UTC
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Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Same as books, i. e. prose fiction: top to bottom, left to right.
For the purposes of this message, manga don't count as comicbooks.
I happened to glance at some manga. It immediately struck me that
it was not exactly 'normal' from my perspective. The front cover
seemed to be on the back. I assume this is because it is Japanese.

Bill
Sea Wasp (Ryk E. Spoor)
2017-02-25 14:59:11 UTC
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Post by Bill Gill
Post by T Guy
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Same as books, i. e. prose fiction: top to bottom, left to right.
For the purposes of this message, manga don't count as comicbooks.
I happened to glance at some manga. It immediately struck me that
it was not exactly 'normal' from my perspective. The front cover
seemed to be on the back. I assume this is because it is Japanese.
The Japanese read in the reverse direction we do, so yes, what we
expect to be the front cover is actually the back. It's like driving in
the USA and then going to the UK and having to realize you have to drive
on what feels to be the wrong side of the road.
--
Sea Wasp
/^\
;;;
Website: http://www.grandcentralarena.com Blog:
http://seawasp.livejournal.com
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2017-02-24 17:41:50 UTC
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Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
There is actually an excellent book on that:

_Understanding Comics: The Invisible Art_ by Scott McCloud
http://amzn.to/2lDQSBI

Presented, appropriately enough, in comic format. I have never seen
a definition of "Art" that I like better than McCloud's.
--
------
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Robert Carnegie
2017-02-24 20:48:08 UTC
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Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Pause to enjoy the pictures as illustrations.
But maybe it just isn't for you.

And there are comics whose illustrations are
very much a matter of taste - or, specifically,
not to mine.
Post by Bill Gill
One odd thing: The story starts with what's her name, the
Russian night witch, being transported in a van with other
female offenders. That is clearly not a thing that would
happen. Nightingale is the only person they have in England
who could control her. Being transported as an ordinary
prisoner is just not in it.
You lost suspension-of-disbelief? That's a
serious problem.

I've just started reading _Rivers of London_,
so I'm many words away from understanding the
specific incongruity.
Bill Gill
2017-02-25 14:12:51 UTC
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Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Post by Bill Gill
Reading the latest Rivers of London book by Ben Aaronovitch
(The Hanging Tree) I find references to some things that didn't
happen in any of the previous books. So I go on line to check it
out. It seems that they have been putting out some comic books
in the series. I haven't read comic books in a long time. I pretty
much quit when I got so that I had access to lots of real books.
Real books have a lot more in them, since they don't have all
of the paper taken up with pictures. Without the pictures
they can put in words instead, and words are much more compact,
so they can get a real story in the same place. But now I may
have to see if I can find the comic books. I think they would
be in the section of the book store marked for "graphic novels".
Bill
Ok, I just got in from the book store. I found a copy of
"Rivers of London: Night Witch". I will check it out and
see whether I think it is worthwhile.
Bill
Well, I sat down to read Night Witch. I got in about maybe 6
or 8 pages and gave up. There is nothing to read in it. Maybe
I need to go back to school and learn how to read comic books.
Pause to enjoy the pictures as illustrations.
But maybe it just isn't for you.
And there are comics whose illustrations are
very much a matter of taste - or, specifically,
not to mine.
Post by Bill Gill
One odd thing: The story starts with what's her name, the
Russian night witch, being transported in a van with other
female offenders. That is clearly not a thing that would
happen. Nightingale is the only person they have in England
who could control her. Being transported as an ordinary
prisoner is just not in it.
You lost suspension-of-disbelief? That's a
serious problem.
I've just started reading _Rivers of London_,
so I'm many words away from understanding the
specific incongruity.
I might have been able to overcome that, but the story just
wasn't flowing, so I gave up.

Bill
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