Discussion:
[tor dot com] Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
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Quadibloc
2020-01-09 19:46:55 UTC
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What, no super pandemic virus ?
That one was excluded precisely because it _could_ actually happen, and, indeed,
has happened a couple of times in our past.

John Savard
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-01-09 19:39:52 UTC
Permalink
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
What, no super pandemic virus ?
Those could seriously damage our species, but not the planet as a
whole.

Connie Willis has explored several pandemics in her work.
_Doomsday Book_ has the Black Death in the fourteenth century, a
Pandemic in its more recent past worthy of being dignified by the
definite article "The", and a less deadly (because contained)
epidemic of fourteen-century influenza affecting the twenty-first
century by means other than time travel. What's more, in _To Say
Nothing of the Dog_ we find in the backstory an epizootic that
wiped out the entire family Felidae.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Carl Fink
2020-01-17 14:44:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Connie Willis has explored several pandemics in her work.
_Doomsday Book_ has the Black Death in the fourteenth century ...
I don't think it does, actually.

It's the superflu that also infects near-future Oxford. Kivrin catches it
from her excavation of the medieval castle corpses, is still infectious
when she time travels, and gives it to the villagers, who then get buried
and give it to her.
--
Carl Fink ***@finknetwork.com
https://reasonablyliterate.com https://nitpicking.com
If you want to make a point, somebody will take the point and stab you with it.
-Kenne Estes
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-01-17 15:22:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Carl Fink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Connie Willis has explored several pandemics in her work.
_Doomsday Book_ has the Black Death in the fourteenth century ...
I don't think it does, actually.
It's the superflu that also infects near-future Oxford. Kivrin catches it
from her excavation of the medieval castle corpses ...
No, she catches it in the 14th century from the contemps in the village,
for whom it's a mild flu to which their population is accustomed.

It is not Kivrin who picks up the virus from the excavation, but
the people who are performing the excavation.

The virus is still "live" (to the extent that a virus can be alive),
and infects the 21st-century population who have not encountered it
in many generations and have no immunity.

I was working for a professor of biochemistry at the time, and
asked him if that was possible, and he said, yes.

Meanwhile, back in the 14th century, it is the plague that kills
everyone in the village, except for Kivrin,, who's been immunized
against it.

If you're looking for a story in which the present and the past
repeatedly influence one another, I suggest Harrison's _The
Technicolor Time Machine._
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
D B Davis
2020-01-17 15:55:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Carl Fink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Connie Willis has explored several pandemics in her work.
_Doomsday Book_ has the Black Death in the fourteenth century ...
I don't think it does, actually.
It's the superflu that also infects near-future Oxford. Kivrin catches it
from her excavation of the medieval castle corpses, is still infectious
when she time travels, and gives it to the villagers, who then get buried
and give it to her.
Pertinent, interesting (to me at least) excerpts from the story:

It's definitely a Type A myxovirus. ...
"If there's a small antigenic shift, a point or two,
it's only the flu," she corrected him. "If there's a
large shift, it's influenza, which is an entirely different
matter. The Spanish Flu pandemic of 1918 was a myxovirus.
It killed twenty million people. Viruses mutate every few
months. The antigens on their surface change so that they're
unrecognizable to the immune system. That's why seasonals
are necessary. But they can't protect against a large point
shift."
"Influenza scarcely compares with the plague," he said,
watching the telephone as if he could will it to ring.
"The Black Death killed one-third to one-half of Europe."
"I know," Colin said. "And the plague was a lot more
interesting. It was spread by rats, and you got these
enormous bobos-"
"Buboes."
"Buboes under your arms, and they turned black and
swelled up till they were enormous and then you died!
The flu doesn't have anything like that," he said,
sounding disappointed.
"No."
"And the flu's only one disease. There were three
sorts of plague. Bubonic, that's the one with the buboes,
pneumonic," he said, pronouncing the P. "It went in your
lungs and you coughed up blood, and sep-tah-keem-ic-"
"Septicemic."
"Septicemic, which went into your bloodstream and
killed you in three hours and your body turned black all
over! Isn't that apocalyptic?"
"Yes," Dunworthy said.

The Black Plague created a shortage of workers in England. For a while
it seemed that worker's wages would rise. Until the Lord Mayor butchered
Wim Tyler in front of the peasants to show them what happens to uppity
peasants. [1]
Plain spoken history contains too much brutal truth. Officially Lord
Mayor dispatched Wim Tyler to protect his young liege's honor or
something.

Seems as good a place as any to pitch Perryverse's Pucky the
mouse-beaver's bubonicon. [2]

Note.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peasants'_Revolt
[2] http://bubonicon.com/



Thank you,
--
Don.......My cat's )\._.,--....,'``.
telltale tall tail /, _.. \ _\ (`._ ,.
tells tall tales.. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
Lynn McGuire
2020-01-17 21:49:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by D B Davis
Post by Carl Fink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Connie Willis has explored several pandemics in her work.
_Doomsday Book_ has the Black Death in the fourteenth century ...
I don't think it does, actually.
It's the superflu that also infects near-future Oxford. Kivrin catches it
from her excavation of the medieval castle corpses, is still infectious
when she time travels, and gives it to the villagers, who then get buried
and give it to her.
It's definitely a Type A myxovirus. ...
"If there's a small antigenic shift, a point or two,
it's only the flu," she corrected him. "If there's a
large shift, it's influenza, which is an entirely different
matter. The Spanish Flu pandemic of 1918 was a myxovirus.
It killed twenty million people. Viruses mutate every few
months. The antigens on their surface change so that they're
unrecognizable to the immune system. That's why seasonals
are necessary. But they can't protect against a large point
shift."
"Influenza scarcely compares with the plague," he said,
watching the telephone as if he could will it to ring.
"The Black Death killed one-third to one-half of Europe."
"I know," Colin said. "And the plague was a lot more
interesting. It was spread by rats, and you got these
enormous bobos-"
"Buboes."
"Buboes under your arms, and they turned black and
swelled up till they were enormous and then you died!
The flu doesn't have anything like that," he said,
sounding disappointed.
"No."
"And the flu's only one disease. There were three
sorts of plague. Bubonic, that's the one with the buboes,
pneumonic," he said, pronouncing the P. "It went in your
lungs and you coughed up blood, and sep-tah-keem-ic-"
"Septicemic."
"Septicemic, which went into your bloodstream and
killed you in three hours and your body turned black all
over! Isn't that apocalyptic?"
"Yes," Dunworthy said.
The Black Plague created a shortage of workers in England. For a while
it seemed that worker's wages would rise. Until the Lord Mayor butchered
Wim Tyler in front of the peasants to show them what happens to uppity
peasants. [1]
Plain spoken history contains too much brutal truth. Officially Lord
Mayor dispatched Wim Tyler to protect his young liege's honor or
something.
Seems as good a place as any to pitch Perryverse's Pucky the
mouse-beaver's bubonicon. [2]
Note.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peasants'_Revolt
[2] http://bubonicon.com/

Thank you,
That Bubonicon looks crazy !

Lynn
D B Davis
2020-01-18 00:46:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by D B Davis
Post by Carl Fink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Connie Willis has explored several pandemics in her work.
_Doomsday Book_ has the Black Death in the fourteenth century ...
I don't think it does, actually.
It's the superflu that also infects near-future Oxford. Kivrin catches it
from her excavation of the medieval castle corpses, is still infectious
when she time travels, and gives it to the villagers, who then get buried
and give it to her.
It's definitely a Type A myxovirus. ...
"If there's a small antigenic shift, a point or two,
it's only the flu," she corrected him. "If there's a
large shift, it's influenza, which is an entirely different
matter. The Spanish Flu pandemic of 1918 was a myxovirus.
It killed twenty million people. Viruses mutate every few
months. The antigens on their surface change so that they're
unrecognizable to the immune system. That's why seasonals
are necessary. But they can't protect against a large point
shift."
"Influenza scarcely compares with the plague," he said,
watching the telephone as if he could will it to ring.
"The Black Death killed one-third to one-half of Europe."
"I know," Colin said. "And the plague was a lot more
interesting. It was spread by rats, and you got these
enormous bobos-"
"Buboes."
"Buboes under your arms, and they turned black and
swelled up till they were enormous and then you died!
The flu doesn't have anything like that," he said,
sounding disappointed.
"No."
"And the flu's only one disease. There were three
sorts of plague. Bubonic, that's the one with the buboes,
pneumonic," he said, pronouncing the P. "It went in your
lungs and you coughed up blood, and sep-tah-keem-ic-"
"Septicemic."
"Septicemic, which went into your bloodstream and
killed you in three hours and your body turned black all
over! Isn't that apocalyptic?"
"Yes," Dunworthy said.
The Black Plague created a shortage of workers in England. For a while
it seemed that worker's wages would rise. Until the Lord Mayor butchered
Wim Tyler in front of the peasants to show them what happens to uppity
peasants. [1]
Plain spoken history contains too much brutal truth. Officially Lord
Mayor dispatched Wim Tyler to protect his young liege's honor or
something.
Seems as good a place as any to pitch Perryverse's Pucky the
mouse-beaver's bubonicon. [2]
Note.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peasants'_Revolt
[2] http://bubonicon.com/
That Bubonicon looks crazy !
One of my desires this year is to attend a con. Denver's the closest big
city and the logical choice for a con.

BTW, my earlier post contains a typo. The Lord Mayor butchered Wat
Tyler.



Thank you,
--
Don.......My cat's )\._.,--....,'``.
telltale tall tail /, _.. \ _\ (`._ ,.
tells tall tales.. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
Jaimie Vandenbergh
2020-01-09 23:12:34 UTC
Permalink
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
What happened in the comments from that piece that the mod had to step in and
sweep away the detritus?

Cheers - Jaimie
--
Sent from my VAX 11/780
James Nicoll
2020-01-10 02:28:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jaimie Vandenbergh
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
What happened in the comments from that piece that the mod had to step in and
sweep away the detritus?
I know I made an excessively snarky comment but otherwise no idea.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Steve Coltrin
2020-01-10 21:51:35 UTC
Permalink
begin fnord
Post by Jaimie Vandenbergh
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
What happened in the comments from that piece that the mod had to step in and
sweep away the detritus?
I think James made an Archduke Ferdinand joke. (Too soon.)
--
Steve Coltrin ***@omcl.org Google Groups killfiled here
"A group known as the League of Human Dignity helped arrange for Deuel
to be driven to a local livestock scale, where he could be weighed."
- Associated Press
James Nicoll
2020-01-10 21:54:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Coltrin
begin fnord
Post by Jaimie Vandenbergh
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
What happened in the comments from that piece that the mod had to step in and
sweep away the detritus?
I think James made an Archduke Ferdinand joke. (Too soon.)
I said that I had had high hopes for World War Three this week but at least that there
are always more Archdukes.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
a***@msn.com
2020-01-11 00:43:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Steve Coltrin
begin fnord
Post by Jaimie Vandenbergh
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
What happened in the comments from that piece that the mod had to step in and
sweep away the detritus?
I think James made an Archduke Ferdinand joke. (Too soon.)
I said that I had had high hopes for World War Three this week but at least that there
are always more Archdukes.
--
And various people responded to the deletion (they could tell the deleted comment was from you by the avatar) rather than the article, so the moderator decided to restart the comment thread again (apparently).
Jaimie Vandenbergh
2020-01-11 12:04:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by a***@msn.com
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Steve Coltrin
begin fnord
Post by Jaimie Vandenbergh
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
What happened in the comments from that piece that the mod had to step in and
sweep away the detritus?
I think James made an Archduke Ferdinand joke. (Too soon.)
I said that I had had high hopes for World War Three this week but at least that there
are always more Archdukes.
--
And various people responded to the deletion (they could tell the deleted comment was from you by the avatar) rather than the article, so the moderator decided to restart the comment thread again (apparently).
Although I feebly object to such moderation, on further thought it's nice to
see Tor aren't just going for the clickbait.

Cheers - Jaimie
--
"But people have always eaten people!
What else is there to eat?
If the Juju had meant us not to eat people
He wouldn't have made us of meat!" -- Flanders & Swann
Kevrob
2020-01-11 04:49:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Steve Coltrin
begin fnord
Post by Jaimie Vandenbergh
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
What happened in the comments from that piece that the mod had to step in and
sweep away the detritus?
I think James made an Archduke Ferdinand joke. (Too soon.)
I said that I had had high hopes for World War Three this week but at least that there
are always more Archdukes.
At my latitude the Feds might interpret such a crack as a threat,
even if lese majestie should not be a crime in a republic.

Kevin R
Joe Bernstein
2020-01-13 02:52:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
At my latitude the Feds might interpret such a crack as a threat,
even if lese majestie should not be a crime in a republic.
I worried for years that past remarks of mine might have put me on a
bad list to be on.

See, back in the 1990s, there was this very popular car alarm that
a) cycled through several annoying siren-ish patterns
and
b) assumed that any movement within a mile of it was an attempt to
steal the car.

So essentially, living in a city meant hearing this alarm pretty much
non-stop, 24/7. I frequently wished death to its inventor, and
probably did so within the hearing of others more than once.
Unfortunately for my peace of mind, the inventor was then elected to
Congress, and stayed there for eighteen years.

Thankfully, he retired last year. Sadly, I see he's now running for
the job again. More importantly, his most evil creation seems to
have more or less died with its decade; I haven't heard one in years,
and since they can't exist without being heard, that probably means
they're no longer both popular and operating.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darrell_Issa>

Joe Bernstein
--
Joe Bernstein <***@gmail.com>
Lynn McGuire
2020-01-18 02:12:41 UTC
Permalink
Five Planetary Catastrophes We'll Probably Never Get to Enjoy
https://www.tor.com/2020/01/09/five-planetary-catastrophes-well-probably-never-get-to-enjoy/
You did not list Black Hole Explosion, _Death Wave_ by Ben Bova:
https://www.amazon.com/Death-Wave-Star-Quest-Trilogy/dp/0765379511/

I have this in my SBR.

Lynn

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