Discussion:
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
(too old to reply)
Lynn McGuire
2021-02-19 21:51:28 UTC
Permalink
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia

https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/

"Dear WorldCon,"

"You are cowards."

"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."

Real men do not treat ladies like this.

Hat tip to:

https://gunfreezone.net/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon-monster-hunter-nation/

Lynn
Dorothy J Heydt
2021-02-19 22:37:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.

Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
Www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-02-19 21:57:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry
Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-
old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for
getting a bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us
lowly deplorable outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics,
you treated my publisher, Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years
later, after you thought the controversy had safely died off,
you felt bad about how you acted and tried to make amends. You
invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you have no concept
of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in
the day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
It's hard to get coherent data out of Larry's rant, but apparently,
she was un-invited to be GOH because of it.

Why does *anybody* care about the Hugos and WorldCon any more? They
don't even take themselves seriously, and it's been decades since
they've mattered.
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Lynn McGuire
2021-02-19 23:17:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The WorldCon invited her to be a Guest of Honor. They rescinded the
invite earlier this week after she had accepted.

Lynn
Andrew McDowell
2021-02-20 05:23:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The WorldCon invited her to be a Guest of Honor. They rescinded the
invite earlier this week after she had accepted.
Lynn
An alternate message would have been to point out that this sort of revolution eats its young. A web search will find multiple right wing sources amused that a reporter has been fired for wrong-tweets - because that reporter worked for the Guardian and previously claimed that there was no such thing as "cancel culture". ObSF - Sarah Hoyt produced an entertaining story heavily influenced by the French Revolution in "Through Fire". If you want to live in a world where there is only one source of Science Fiction, from whoever the last publisher standing was after a storm of grievance archeology and agent provocateurs, fail to support Baen now. Oh - and you lose Eric Flint, as well.
Hamish Laws
2021-02-20 16:14:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The WorldCon invited her to be a Guest of Honor. They rescinded the
invite earlier this week after she had accepted.
An alternate message would have been to point out that this sort of revolution eats its young.
Yeah, no doubt there are just 100s of publishers who are ignoring posts on their forums suggesting terrorist attacks on cities, murdering a cop etc...
Post by Andrew McDowell
A web search will find multiple right wing sources amused that a reporter has been fired for wrong-tweets - because that reporter worked for the Guardian and previously claimed that there was no such thing as "cancel culture".
How about you provide sources to back up your claim rather than just asserting that they're there?
Post by Andrew McDowell
ObSF - Sarah Hoyt produced an entertaining story heavily influenced by the French Revolution in "Through Fire". If you want to live in a world where there is only one source of Science Fiction, from whoever the last publisher standing was after a storm of grievance archeology and agent provocateurs, fail to support Baen now. Oh - and you lose Eric Flint, as well.
Slippery slope arguments aren't overly convincing.
Andrew McDowell
2021-02-20 16:56:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hamish Laws
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The WorldCon invited her to be a Guest of Honor. They rescinded the
invite earlier this week after she had accepted.
An alternate message would have been to point out that this sort of revolution eats its young.
Yeah, no doubt there are just 100s of publishers who are ignoring posts on their forums suggesting terrorist attacks on cities, murdering a cop etc...
Post by Andrew McDowell
A web search will find multiple right wing sources amused that a reporter has been fired for wrong-tweets - because that reporter worked for the Guardian and previously claimed that there was no such thing as "cancel culture".
How about you provide sources to back up your claim rather than just asserting that they're there?
(trimmed)
I left the source to the reader's search skills because I didn't immediately see the story covered in the non-deplorable media. However on second search I reference https://www.newsweek.com/cancel-culture-has-anti-semitism-problem-opinion-1568648

We talk about cancel culture a lot. We talk less about the double standard when it comes to Jews. But that's a big part of the story, and a part that erupted on Wednesday when Nathan Robinson, a columnist for the Guardian and editor-in-chief of the magazine Current Affairs, claimed his Guardian column was canceled due to some tweets about Israel.
(end quote)

A web search suggests that his claim that cancel culture does not exist was https://www.currentaffairs.org/2020/07/the-right-wing-myth-of-the-left-wing-mob - a quick scan suggests that the URL is not a completely misleading guide to the article
Rollory
2021-02-21 20:42:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hamish Laws
Slippery slope arguments aren't overly convincing.
Slippery slope arguments are logical fallacies. Human beings are not
logical - they are rationalizing, not necessarily rational, and their
reasoning process is biological, not a perfectly abstract logic engine.
Slippery slope arguments are accurate experimental descriptions of human
behavior - most easily observed in child-rearing. Therefore, slippery
slope arguments are only unconvincing to individuals who do not
understand and/or have little experience with human beings.
Robert Woodward
2021-02-20 05:43:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fan
s-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee. But, I have wondered if Jason Sanford had informed Toni
Weisskopf about these inappropriate posts before going public. If Toni
Weisskopf was blindsided about the whole thing (she was not reading
every post on every forum on Baen's Bar), then I can think of no polite
way to describe Jason Sanford's action.
--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
‹-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward ***@drizzle.com
Robert Carnegie
2021-02-20 11:48:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fan
s-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee.
Whose is the (Not) "Real men" line? And to whom does it refer?

The text in quotes is by Larry Correia, I assume.
I'm not viewing his Web site because some Web sites
do bad things on your computer, with or without the
site owner's intention.

Real men is not in quotes so it looks like a response
to Larry Correia. Possibly by Lynn. Possibly not.

It may refer to the WorldCon committee. It may refer to
Larry Correia.

I do not know if the WorldCon committee are men.
With equal representation we should have two A.I.s
and a cyborg on the team by now. Their mascot looks
like an android to me but I'm not saying I know for sure.
And I wouldn't ask.

<https://discon3.org>
<https://discon3.org/about/committee-and-staff/>

I know "Satchel" as a type of luggage. I think
the Stainless Steel Rat, the Man From ROBOT,
and Terry Pratchett had independent minded
luggage. But, loyal.
Andrew McDowell
2021-02-20 12:19:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fan
s-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee.
Whose is the (Not) "Real men" line? And to whom does it refer?
The text in quotes is by Larry Correia, I assume.
I'm not viewing his Web site because some Web sites
do bad things on your computer, with or without the
site owner's intention.
(trimmed)
I can view the site https://monsterhunternation.com/ from behind a reasonably paranoid corporate firewall, without triggering any alerts, so I suspect that it is - at least currently - no more risky than any other popular media site. Corriea's comments hold pride of place, and are quite lengthy. The only warning I might give is for commonplace profanity. Despite Robert Woodward's comments above and Corriea's piece (which is well worth reading) I suspect that Correia could have produced something equally powerful and readable without resort to profanity, if he really put his mind to it.
Robert Carnegie
2021-02-20 13:33:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fan
s-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee.
Whose is the (Not) "Real men" line? And to whom does it refer?
The text in quotes is by Larry Correia, I assume.
I'm not viewing his Web site because some Web sites
do bad things on your computer, with or without the
site owner's intention.
(trimmed)
I can view the site https://monsterhunternation.com/ from behind a reasonably paranoid corporate firewall, without triggering any alerts, so I suspect that it is - at least currently - no more risky than any other popular media site. Corriea's comments hold pride of place, and are quite lengthy. The only warning I might give is for commonplace profanity. Despite Robert Woodward's comments above and Corriea's piece (which is well worth reading) I suspect that Correia could have produced something equally powerful and readable without resort to profanity, if he really put his mind to it.
Thank you. I went ahead, and I did not find real men
on that web page.
Andrew McDowell
2021-02-20 14:00:12 UTC
Permalink
I guess I am deviating, but Eric Flint's reaction on https://ericflint.net/information/controversy-about-baens-bar/ is interesting and impressive. Interesting to me because I had worked out from Drake's home page that he wasn't a Trump fan, but had not got as far as "David Drake would vote for a warthog before he’d vote for Trump, and anyone who knows him would know that" (I thought Drake might at least appreciate what was called isolationism on this side of the Atlantic). Impressive because I have not recently heard a left wing point of view that actually sees a good side to freedom of speech.
Hamish Laws
2021-02-20 16:39:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew McDowell
I guess I am deviating, but Eric Flint's reaction on https://ericflint.net/information/controversy-about-baens-bar/ is interesting and impressive.
If you ignore the fact that he states that he hasn't been in the forum where most of the problematic posts occur for a couple of decades because it was stupid then.
And he's ignoring that the point of the article is what's posted on the boards, not the books Baen publishes.
Post by Andrew McDowell
Interesting to me because I had worked out from Drake's home page that he wasn't a Trump fan, but had not got as far as "David Drake would vote for a warthog before he’d vote for Trump, and anyone who knows him would know that" (I thought Drake might at least appreciate what was called isolationism on this side of the Atlantic).
Impressive because I have not recently heard a left wing point of view that actually sees a good side to freedom of speech.
Stop sucking from the fox well of bullshit
James Nicoll
2021-02-20 17:04:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hamish Laws
Stop sucking from the fox well of bullshit
That is an exceptionally mixed metaphor.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Andrew McDowell
2021-02-20 19:32:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Hamish Laws
Stop sucking from the fox well of bullshit
That is an exceptionally mixed metaphor.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Is this "fox well" as in a small rural spring? It is a sufficiently unlikely phrase to me that I wonder if there is some regional or biological interpretation of which I am blissfully ignorant.
James Nicoll
2021-02-20 19:49:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Hamish Laws
Stop sucking from the fox well of bullshit
That is an exceptionally mixed metaphor.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Is this "fox well" as in a small rural spring? It is a sufficiently unlikely
phrase to me that I wonder if there is some regional or biological
interpretation of which I am blissfully ignorant.
My interpretation is that Fox = Murdoch's propaganda outlet, bullshit
a comment on their product, but one does not suck a well.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Andrew McDowell
2021-02-20 20:08:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Hamish Laws
Stop sucking from the fox well of bullshit
That is an exceptionally mixed metaphor.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Is this "fox well" as in a small rural spring? It is a sufficiently unlikely
phrase to me that I wonder if there is some regional or biological
interpretation of which I am blissfully ignorant.
My interpretation is that Fox = Murdoch's propaganda outlet, bullshit
a comment on their product, but one does not suck a well.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Thank you - sucking a well is not completely inconceivable - see the two Holy Wells at https://www.osi.ie/blog/holy-wells/ - you could at least lap or kneel as at Judges 7:5 - which was first explained to me as an early example of special forces selection, by a teacher who spent part of WWII training new recruits for the RAF Regiment. I went looking for this after being familiar with a well in N.Ireland with a very high water table - three or four steps at the top would often take you to the surface of the water, and I once saw peat being dug in an adjacent field (as a demonstration only - it wasn't used for this purpose).
Quadibloc
2021-02-21 01:13:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
but one does not suck a well.
True, but if he had said "sucking at the Fox teat of bullshit", the metaphor
would not merely have been exceptionally mixed, it would have been
intolerably mixed.

John Savard
Lawrence Watt-Evans
2021-02-20 20:48:22 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 20 Feb 2021 11:32:22 -0800 (PST), Andrew McDowell
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Hamish Laws
Stop sucking from the fox well of bullshit
That is an exceptionally mixed metaphor.
Is this "fox well" as in a small rural spring? It is a sufficiently unlikely phrase to me that I wonder if there is some regional or biological interpretation of which I am blissfully ignorant.
That's "Fox" as in Fox News, I think.
--
My webpage is at http://www.watt-evans.com
My latest novel is Tom Derringer & the Steam-Powered Saurians.
See http://www.ethshar.com/StoneUnturned.shtml
James Nicoll
2021-02-20 21:12:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lawrence Watt-Evans
On Sat, 20 Feb 2021 11:32:22 -0800 (PST), Andrew McDowell
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Hamish Laws
Stop sucking from the fox well of bullshit
That is an exceptionally mixed metaphor.
Is this "fox well" as in a small rural spring? It is a sufficiently unlikely
phrase to me that I wonder if there is some regional or biological
interpretation of which I am blissfully ignorant.
That's "Fox" as in Fox News, I think.
I do like the idea of wells for foxes to drink out of.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Michael F. Stemper
2021-02-20 14:17:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Carnegie
I know "Satchel" as a type of luggage. I think
the Stainless Steel Rat, the Man From ROBOT,
and Terry Pratchett had independent minded
luggage. But, loyal.
I don't recall any from SSR, although I stopped reading them
three or four books after it jumped the shark. (Slow learner)

However, there was some loyal and intelligent luggage in
Stross's _Singularity Sky_. Complete with 3D printer.

Also, I believe that Sean Derry had a self-returning satchel
in one of the Lord Darcy stories. Possibly _Too Many
Magicians_.
--
Michael F. Stemper
This email is to be read by its intended recipient only. Any other party
reading is required by the EULA to send me $500.00.
Ross Presser
2021-02-24 20:15:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael F. Stemper
I know "Satchel" as a type of luggage. I think
the Stainless Steel Rat, the Man From ROBOT,
and Terry Pratchett had independent minded
luggage. But, loyal.
I don't recall any from SSR, although I stopped reading them
three or four books after it jumped the shark. (Slow learner)
However, there was some loyal and intelligent luggage in
Stross's _Singularity Sky_. Complete with 3D printer.
Also, I believe that Sean Derry had a self-returning satchel
in one of the Lord Darcy stories. Possibly _Too Many
Magicians_.
The forensic sorceror in _Too Many Magicians_ is named Master Sean
O Lochlainn, not Derry. The word satchel does not appear in the book,
but your memory was correct: it was called a carpetbag.

] She noticed the symbol-decorated carpetbag, of course. There was one
] like it in almost every room during this convention. But she paid no attention
] to it consciously.
]
] Her subconscious, however, whispered to her that “it didn’t ought to be here.”

Off the beaten track, Soph has loyal, intelligent, protective and
dangerous luggage in _DeepDrive_ by Alexander Jabalokov.
Ross Presser
2021-02-24 20:22:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael F. Stemper
I know "Satchel" as a type of luggage. I think
the Stainless Steel Rat, the Man From ROBOT,
and Terry Pratchett had independent minded
luggage. But, loyal.
I don't recall any from SSR, although I stopped reading them
three or four books after it jumped the shark. (Slow learner)
In _The Stainless Steel Rat's Revenge_, there is a luggage *robot* --
a sort of automatic luggage cart. It carries luggage, it is not luggage
itself.
http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/content.asp?Bnum=2502
Robert Carnegie
2021-02-25 03:31:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross Presser
Post by Michael F. Stemper
I know "Satchel" as a type of luggage. I think
the Stainless Steel Rat, the Man From ROBOT,
and Terry Pratchett had independent minded
luggage. But, loyal.
I don't recall any from SSR, although I stopped reading them
three or four books after it jumped the shark. (Slow learner)
In _The Stainless Steel Rat's Revenge_, there is a luggage *robot* --
a sort of automatic luggage cart. It carries luggage, it is not luggage
itself.
http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/content.asp?Bnum=2502
I was thinking of a sort of spy's suitcase that may have
had things popping out of its body like Inspector Gadget,
such as checking for hotel bugging devices etc. Or, guns.
Maybe indeed in _The Stainless Steel Rat's Revenge_
as he goes sneaking around. Not the only time. He also
adopts Vaska's identity.
Michael F. Stemper
2021-02-25 14:14:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross Presser
Post by Michael F. Stemper
I know "Satchel" as a type of luggage. I think
the Stainless Steel Rat, the Man From ROBOT,
and Terry Pratchett had independent minded
luggage. But, loyal.
I don't recall any from SSR, although I stopped reading them
three or four books after it jumped the shark. (Slow learner)
In _The Stainless Steel Rat's Revenge_, there is a luggage *robot* --
a sort of automatic luggage cart. It carries luggage, it is not luggage
itself.
http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/content.asp?Bnum=2502
Okay, reading about the *five* pieces of luggage brought it back.
--
Michael F. Stemper
Nostalgia just ain't what it used to be.
Michael F. Stemper
2021-02-25 14:13:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross Presser
Post by Michael F. Stemper
I know "Satchel" as a type of luggage. I think
the Stainless Steel Rat, the Man From ROBOT,
and Terry Pratchett had independent minded
luggage. But, loyal.
I don't recall any from SSR, although I stopped reading them
three or four books after it jumped the shark. (Slow learner)
However, there was some loyal and intelligent luggage in
Stross's _Singularity Sky_. Complete with 3D printer.
Also, I believe that Sean Derry had a self-returning satchel
in one of the Lord Darcy stories. Possibly _Too Many
Magicians_.
The forensic sorceror in _Too Many Magicians_ is named Master Sean
O Lochlainn, not Derry.
Searching reminds me that Sean, Lord Derry was a character in the first
Deryni trilogy.
--
Michael F. Stemper
This post contains greater than 95% post-consumer bytes by weight.
Hamish Laws
2021-02-20 15:25:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fan
s-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee.
Whose is the (Not) "Real men" line? And to whom does it refer?
The text in quotes is by Larry Correia, I assume.
I'm not viewing his Web site because some Web sites
do bad things on your computer, with or without the
site owner's intention.
Real men is not in quotes so it looks like a response
to Larry Correia. Possibly by Lynn. Possibly not.
It's obviously Lynn commenting on the Worldcon committee retracting the guest of honor invitation
James Nicoll
2021-02-20 14:09:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fan
s-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee. But, I have wondered if Jason Sanford had informed Toni
Weisskopf about these inappropriate posts before going public. If Toni
Weisskopf was blindsided about the whole thing (she was not reading
every post on every forum on Baen's Bar), then I can think of no polite
way to describe Jason Sanford's action.
Why on Earth would he be obligated to point out to her what is a notorious
part of the Baen Bar? Flint's attempted defense includes this interesting
section:

"I stopped visiting Politics about oh, I dunno. Twenty-three years ago?
The reason I did is because, as Darth Vader would say, The stupid is strong
with these ones."

So for a quarter century, Politics has been a festering swamp. How could this
come as a surprise to TW?
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Robert Woodward
2021-02-21 18:49:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-
fan
s-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee. But, I have wondered if Jason Sanford had informed Toni
Weisskopf about these inappropriate posts before going public. If Toni
Weisskopf was blindsided about the whole thing (she was not reading
every post on every forum on Baen's Bar), then I can think of no polite
way to describe Jason Sanford's action.
Why on Earth would he be obligated to point out to her what is a notorious
part of the Baen Bar? Flint's attempted defense includes this interesting
Because if someone is claiming to be a better person, they should make
the effort to be so. After all, the goal is stop the calls and planning
for insurrection. So give Toni a chance to fix the problem. Otherwise,
it is a case of destroying the village to "save" it.
Post by James Nicoll
"I stopped visiting Politics about oh, I dunno. Twenty-three years ago?
The reason I did is because, as Darth Vader would say, The stupid is strong
with these ones."
I think I have seen Flint in there more recent than 23 years ago (which
would had been right after the publication of his first book). It has an
echo chamber for some time (I think Rush Limbaugh fans, but I never
listened to him, so I am just guessing.
Post by James Nicoll
So for a quarter century, Politics has been a festering swamp. How could this
come as a surprise to TW?
I much prefer the phrase echo chamber (festering swamp assumes that they
are wrong on everything, an assumption I consider unwise to make, if
only because I believe nobody is right on everything).
--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
‹-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward ***@drizzle.com
Joel Polowin
2021-02-21 22:26:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by James Nicoll
Why on Earth would he be obligated to point out to her what is a notorious
part of the Baen Bar? Flint's attempted defense includes this interesting
Because if someone is claiming to be a better person, they should make
the effort to be so. After all, the goal is stop the calls and planning
for insurrection. So give Toni a chance to fix the problem. Otherwise,
it is a case of destroying the village to "save" it.
The notice from the Worldcon committee said that the disinvitation came
after discussions with Weisskopf. This *suggests* that they had reached
an impasse, since presumably the concom would much rather have been able
to keep her as GoH.

Joel
--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
Quadibloc
2021-02-22 22:53:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Joel Polowin
The notice from the Worldcon committee said that the disinvitation came
after discussions with Weisskopf. This *suggests* that they had reached
an impasse, since presumably the concom would much rather have been able
to keep her as GoH.
While that is positive news, of course it does not prove that the Worldcon
committee did not ask things of her that were unreasonable. While I am inclined
to side with Worldcon rather than Baen, and certainly I have no sympathy for
_some_ of the voices taking Baen's side, I also think it's very important to keep
our facts straight, our vision clear, and our perspective accurate.

The fact that Toni Weisskopf _did_ place Baen's Bar on hiatus makes it appear to
me that there was no legitimate reason to disinvite her. Perhaps the problem was
that she only did so after her own investigation of the issue, while being unable to
render a definite promise to take some such action on the basis of a case presented
to her by the Worldcon committee. If that's the case, it _is_ her principled stand for
free speech, and _not_ condoning calls for violence, that ended up getting her
disinvited.

In that particular case, what sort of apology could Worldcon give? "You weren't
what we thought you were; sorry we made the mistake of thinking you take orders
from us?" Of course, this is just _one_ possibility, but it's the sort of impasse that I
could see happening from (basically) good intentions on both sides... but also just
a little too much ego all around.

John Savard
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-02-22 22:24:27 UTC
Permalink
On Sunday, February 21, 2021 at 3:26:58 PM UTC-7, Joel Polowin
Post by Joel Polowin
The notice from the Worldcon committee said that the
disinvitation came after discussions with Weisskopf. This
*suggests* that they had reached an impasse, since presumably
the concom would much rather have been able to keep her as GoH.
While that is positive news, of course it does not prove that
the Worldcon committee did not ask things of her that were
unreasonable. While I am inclined to side with Worldcon rather
than Baen, and certainly I have no sympathy for _some_ of the
voices taking Baen's side, I also think it's very important to
keep our facts straight, our vision clear, and our perspective
accurate.
The fact that Toni Weisskopf _did_ place Baen's Bar on hiatus
makes it appear to me that there was no legitimate reason to
disinvite her. Perhaps the problem was that she only did so
after her own investigation of the issue, while being unable to
render a definite promise to take some such action on the basis
of a case presented to her by the Worldcon committee. If that's
the case, it _is_ her principled stand for free speech, and
_not_ condoning calls for violence, that ended up getting her
disinvited.
I think you're assuming that there are *un*intended consequences
here. I wouldn't bet on it.
In that particular case, what sort of apology could Worldcon
give? "You weren't what we thought you were; sorry we made the
mistake of thinking you take orders from us?" Of course, this is
just _one_ possibility, but it's the sort of impasse that I
could see happening from (basically) good intentions on both
sides... but also just a little too much ego all around.
They're not capable of admitting there's anything to apologize for.
IF cornered with their lies, they'll double down. Mark my words.

Wny *anyone* takes WorldCon seriously any more is a mystery for the
ages.
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Quadibloc
2021-02-22 22:33:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Woodward
(I think Rush Limbaugh fans, but I never
listened to him, so I am just guessing.
When he first started out, he seemed like a breath of fresh air.

But later on, he just got more and more extreme, or so it seemed to me.

John Savard
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-02-22 22:04:57 UTC
Permalink
On Sunday, February 21, 2021 at 11:50:05 AM UTC-7, Robert
Post by Robert Woodward
(I think Rush Limbaugh fans, but I never
listened to him, so I am just guessing.
When he first started out, he seemed like a breath of fresh air.
But later on, he just got more and more extreme, or so it seemed to me.
He played to his fans, certainly. He was vert skilled at it.
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Joy Beeson
2021-02-24 00:42:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
So for a quarter century, Politics has been a festering swamp. How could this
come as a surprise to TW?
It isn't a festering swamp -- it's a cesspool into which objectionable
matter is drained.
--
Joy Beeson
joy beeson at centurylink dot net
Hamish Laws
2021-02-20 16:31:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Woodward
But, I have wondered if Jason Sanford had informed Toni
Weisskopf about these inappropriate posts before going public. If Toni
Weisskopf was blindsided about the whole thing (she was not reading
every post on every forum on Baen's Bar), then I can think of no polite
way to describe Jason Sanford's action.
http://file770.com/weisskopf-correia-weber-defend-baens-bar-jason-sanford-subjected-to-harassment-over-his-report/
has various comments made on the Baen forums over several months
They are ignoring comments suggesting getting a cop murdered, calls for Trump to start up a private army and threaten a civil war...

Oh, and to give you an idea about the level of behaviour Baen has been fine with over the years check this thread out
https://forums.sufficientvelocity.com/threads/shit-the-kratskeller-says-warning-transphobia-homophobia-sexism-racism-general-fascism.1667/
pyotr filipivich
2021-02-21 15:39:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee.
And those who support said committee with their registration
dollars, euros, pounds, etc.
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Us(tm) to serve as the new Them(tm)
Robert Carnegie
2021-02-21 23:13:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee.
And those who support said committee with their registration
dollars, euros, pounds, etc.
Well, the actions criticised seem to be those of
the organisers.
pyotr filipivich
2021-02-21 23:54:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee.
And those who support said committee with their registration
dollars, euros, pounds, etc.
Well, the actions criticised seem to be those of
the organisers.
Yes it was.

But the letter was _addressed_ to the _fans_. Those who give
support to said committee by sending them money. "Voting with their
wallets" by buying tickets, etc.
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Us(tm) to serve as the new Them(tm)
Robert Carnegie
2021-02-22 03:53:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Robert Woodward
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
The "you" Mr. Correia was referring is of course, the Worldcon
committee.
And those who support said committee with their registration
dollars, euros, pounds, etc.
Well, the actions criticised seem to be those of
the organisers.
Yes it was.
But the letter was _addressed_ to the _fans_. Those who give
support to said committee by sending them money. "Voting with their
wallets" by buying tickets, etc.
It's "To The Old Time Fans At WorldCon". But the next
convention is in August. No one is "at WorldCon" now
except for, I'm not sure how this works, I think the DisCon
organisers. Maybe no one will be at WorldCon then if
the pandemic is still going. And; as I say, the remarks
are addressed to "you" who have treated badly
Toni Weisskopf. Now, convention members expressed
concern, but the committee acted.

They could have demoted her to Guest Of, I suppose.
James Nicoll
2021-02-22 14:57:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by pyotr filipivich
wallets" by buying tickets, etc.
Memberships. There's a really handy phrase to denote the DragonCon sort of
for profit convention and the NFP variety. Worldcons are the later sort of
effort. As a consequence, many of their failure modes involves volunteers.
E.g. Boskone, where it turned out the power function on the scaling rule
for the con was less than one. Reading between the lines, DisCon III ran
into the issue that volunteers who just watched an army of RWNJ would not
work at a con celebrating someone whose company provided safe haven for
RWNJ.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
James Nicoll
2021-02-22 15:03:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by pyotr filipivich
wallets" by buying tickets, etc.
Memberships. There's a really handy phrase to denote the DragonCon sort of
for profit convention and the NFP variety.
It being Monday morning, I forgot to add I can never remember
what it is, thanks to the aphasia.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
pyotr filipivich
2021-02-22 17:06:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by pyotr filipivich
wallets" by buying tickets, etc.
Memberships. There's a really handy phrase to denote the DragonCon sort of
for profit convention and the NFP variety. Worldcons are the later sort of
effort. As a consequence, many of their failure modes involves volunteers.
Another version of "voting with your wallet" - spending time
instead of money. (Spending your money too, without expectation of
recompense).

The fans who support Worldcon either directly by sending them
money or spending their own, are supporting the WorldCon (et al.)
committee.

"Their money, their choice" remains, but as "freedom of
association" is now permitted only for the Correct Associations, well,
You may not be interested in the Gleichshaltung, but the
Gleichshaltung is interested in you.
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Us(tm) to serve as the new Them(tm)
Hamish Laws
2021-02-20 15:24:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
No indeed.
Can you summarize how the poster "screwed over" Weisskopf? I
never met her, but we had several phone conversations back in the
day, and I don't think she would be easily cowed.
She was invited as a guest of honour
That invitation has been revoked because the Baen boards have been fine with posts like


“With the idiocy of Pelosi and company on this truly obscene impeachment fiasco, and what the social media types are doing now, ACW2 is marginally closer. At this rate by summer the gunpowder will be burning everywhere.”
ACW2 is American Civil War 2

“Trump losing is a good thing. IF he had won things would be better for a while but the Dims would keep up the garbage. Now they will do the stupid power mad grab that will set off what NEEDS to happen. Which is ACW2. Those that claim its already happening as usual cannot understand reality. A real civil war is killing in job lots and all that goes with it.”

“As I’ve already pointed out, rendering ANY large city is uninhabitable is quite easy... And the Left lives in cities. The question is just how many of its inhabitants will survive...”

“The point is to kill enough of them that they can not arise for another 50 years... or more.”

(the last 2 comments are from a moderator)

“The problem isn’t that you killed too many, but that you killed too few.”

“Since the week of the event, There has been very little said, compared to the sort of coverage you see for someone like George Floyd or Jacob Blake. Look at some ugly facts; She was White. She was not a large woman. She was unarmed. The only thing that would have got this swept under the rug faster, was if the shooter had been black.”

“Which is why the guy needs doxed... After that, the problem will take care of itself.”
(another post by a moderator)

“Cleaning our weapons and waiting until you and yours make the final fatal mistake.”

“I can see a smallish force with good skills at explosive handling, bringing a large city to its knees just through a few well-placed booms at some of the points I mentioned.”

“You aren’t seeing a lot of public commentary because all communications are insecure. But most of the former SpecOps people I know have gone quiet. People who trained for twenty years to lead insurgencies or put rounds on target at a mile plus. The Left has also driven off a lot of cops who couldn’t stomach their behavior, most major cities are seriously understaffed at this point.”
(another post by a moderator)

“Is it real enough yet? Are we going to sit by and watch as we did during the late 30’s and let the pograms play out? Are we gonna let the Katyn Forest repeat? Wait until there is proof the bodies are stacking up? The lack of immediacy on the right is disgusting.”


Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers, its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites, or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is worthy in and of itself."
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2021-02-20 19:34:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hamish Laws
Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers,
its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This
applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites,
or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what
is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages
for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the
publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is
worthy in and of itself."
Sounds like a principled stand to me.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Andrew McDowell
2021-02-20 19:47:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Hamish Laws
Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers,
its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This
applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites,
or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what
is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages
for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the
publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is
worthy in and of itself."
Sounds like a principled stand to me.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
I am reminded of the difficulty western governments sometimes face in explaining to more autocratic governments that the latest robust statement from some western newspaper is not in fact an expression of government policy. The autocrat is not necessarily stupid: they are just used to a system in which all messages follow the party line. This would the natural effect of cancelling everything else.
Quadibloc
2021-02-21 01:09:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Hamish Laws
Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers,
its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This
applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites,
or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what
is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages
for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the
publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is
worthy in and of itself."
Sounds like a principled stand to me.
No doubt it is. But incitement to violence is not protected speech, and on
January 6, 2021, we saw that this particular kind of incitement to violence
is not something that can merely be laughed off.

Thus, it is, regrettably, entirely understandable that despite wishing to extend
an olive branch to Toni Weisskopf, and recognize her contributions to science
fiction, an apparent position of inaction towards calls to violence would be
sufficient cause to withdraw an invitation, even on short notice.

However, there *are* some valid grounds to criticize WorldCon, if not in the terms
used by Larry Correia. Toni Weisskopf's principled stand on free speech _did_
have limits - she put Baen's Bar on hiatus once she became aware of the actual calls
for violence there. Thus, this situation no longer provides a real reason to uninvite
her on such a sudden basis.

John Savard
pyotr filipivich
2021-02-21 15:39:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Hamish Laws
Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers,
its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This
applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites,
or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what
is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages
for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the
publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is
worthy in and of itself."
Sounds like a principled stand to me.
No doubt it is. But incitement to violence is not protected speech, and on
January 6, 2021, we saw that this particular kind of incitement to violence
is not something that can merely be laughed off.
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Us(tm) to serve as the new Them(tm)
Lynn McGuire
2021-02-22 22:43:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Hamish Laws
Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers,
its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This
applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites,
or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what
is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages
for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the
publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is
worthy in and of itself."
Sounds like a principled stand to me.
No doubt it is. But incitement to violence is not protected speech, and on
January 6, 2021, we saw that this particular kind of incitement to violence
is not something that can merely be laughed off.
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.

Lynn
Quadibloc
2021-02-22 23:09:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.

And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I was hoping
for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump really was a wolf, but he still
got kicked out.

John Savard
J. Clarke
2021-02-23 00:34:25 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.
And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I was hoping
for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump really was a wolf, but he still
got kicked out.
Sorry, but Trump is a bad tempered chihuahua at best (although
chihuahuas don't deserve the insult). I would say that he's a mouse
studying hard to be a rat but he hasn't made it to mouse yet.
pyotr filipivich
2021-02-23 01:51:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.
And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I was hoping
for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump really was a wolf, but he still
got kicked out.
Sorry, but Trump is a bad tempered chihuahua at best (although
chihuahuas don't deserve the insult). I would say that he's a mouse
studying hard to be a rat but he hasn't made it to mouse yet.
Whoosh.
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Us(tm) to serve as the new Them(tm)
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-02-23 16:07:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since
Thomas Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the
Democrat Party Activists in the Corporate Media going to
call a Nehemiah Scudder that will have any meaning other
than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up
the continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.
And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I
was hoping for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump
really was a wolf, but he still got kicked out.
Sorry, but Trump is a bad tempered chihuahua at best (although
chihuahuas don't deserve the insult). I would say that he's a
mouse studying hard to be a rat but he hasn't made it to mouse
yet.
Whoosh.
You say that like Clarke missing the point was unexpected.
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Alan Baker
2021-02-23 02:21:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.
And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I was hoping
for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump really was a wolf, but he still
got kicked out.
Sorry, but Trump is a bad tempered chihuahua at best (although
chihuahuas don't deserve the insult). I would say that he's a mouse
studying hard to be a rat but he hasn't made it to mouse yet.
Even a chihuahua can do a lot of damage...
The Horny Goat
2021-03-09 00:18:58 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.
And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I was hoping
for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump really was a wolf, but he still
got kicked out.
It's not entirely implausible that if Heinlein had actually WRITTEN
the Scudder novel (and yes I remember his stated reasons why he
didn't) that America might have been spared Trump.

Though in fairness I remain gobsmacked that a politician on his 3rd
wife having had his first two leave him due to infidelity could ever
be a hero to the religious right.
Kevrob
2021-03-09 00:47:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.
And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I was hoping
for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump really was a wolf, but he still
got kicked out.
It's not entirely implausible that if Heinlein had actually WRITTEN
the Scudder novel (and yes I remember his stated reasons why he
didn't) that America might have been spared Trump.
Though in fairness I remain gobsmacked that a politician on his 3rd
wife having had his first two leave him due to infidelity could ever
be a hero to the religious right.
They got the Supreme Court judges they wanted. They were willing
to swallow anything for that, combined with DJT's lip service to
"Christian values." For the rest of the right, there was a tax cut.
Quite a few conservative voters wanted both. "Social issues" were
one reason I quit being a Republican 40+ years ago. I agreed with
Reagan on immigration and trade, and he cut deals with the Russians
on nukes that made the world safer. Today's "Republicans" wouldn't
nominate a "dangerous RINO" like that! :)
--
Kevin R
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2021-03-09 01:30:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.
And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I was hoping
for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump really was a wolf, but
he still
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Quadibloc
got kicked out.
It's not entirely implausible that if Heinlein had actually WRITTEN
the Scudder novel (and yes I remember his stated reasons why he
didn't) that America might have been spared Trump.
Though in fairness I remain gobsmacked that a politician on his 3rd
wife having had his first two leave him due to infidelity could ever
be a hero to the religious right.
They got the Supreme Court judges they wanted. They were willing
to swallow anything for that, combined with DJT's lip service to
"Christian values." For the rest of the right, there was a tax cut.
Quite a few conservative voters wanted both. "Social issues" were
one reason I quit being a Republican 40+ years ago. I agreed with
Reagan on immigration and trade, and he cut deals with the Russians
on nukes that made the world safer. Today's "Republicans" wouldn't
nominate a "dangerous RINO" like that! :)
--
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Quadibloc
2021-03-09 11:27:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
While I can imagine that many Trump voters held such attitudes as
expressed in the article, it read as though I was reading The Onion.

However, while it's hard for me to imagine either the Democrats or
the Republicans making Christianity, _per se_, illegal, I can understand
that more conservative Christians may have some concerns. The
society in which they live is getting more and more hostile to forms of
Christianity that oppose abortion, that refuse to reconcile themselves
with equality for homosexuals, and that espouse Creationism.

So they could percieve that Democratic party as having at least some
chance of throwing up legal roadblocks to their practice of their faith.
Under most circumstances, this is not surprising. Given, however, many
aspects of the Trump presidency, that this leads to a conflict that has
come to a head is not surprising, since other groups feel that they have
stakes in it as well; for example, black Americans had reason to feel that
Trump's Republicans were out to seriously obstruct their ability to vote.

John Savard
Greg Weeks
2021-03-09 13:02:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
While I can imagine that many Trump voters held such attitudes as
expressed in the article, it read as though I was reading The Onion.
It is a satire site after all.

"About Us
What is The Babylon Bee?

The Babylon Bee is the world’s best satire site, totally inerrant in all its truth claims. We write satire about Christian stuff, political stuff, and everyday life."

Greg
Quadibloc
2021-03-09 19:33:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Greg Weeks
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
While I can imagine that many Trump voters held such attitudes as
expressed in the article, it read as though I was reading The Onion.
It is a satire site after all.
Oh dear. Yes. After going to its front page, I see...

eBay pulls "Mein Kampf" upon discovery Hitler doodled Chinese man with chopsticks in margins
Jeep sues Cherokee tribe to force them to change their name

and so on.

John Savard
Quadibloc
2021-03-09 19:55:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Greg Weeks
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
While I can imagine that many Trump voters held such attitudes as
expressed in the article, it read as though I was reading The Onion.
It is a satire site after all.
Oh dear. Yes. After going to its front page, I see...
eBay pulls "Mein Kampf" upon discovery Hitler doodled Chinese man with chopsticks in margins
Jeep sues Cherokee tribe to force them to change their name
and so on.
Ah. Further thought has permitted me to account for my... previous muted
reaction. Instead of immediately recognizing the story as a satire, why did
I notice some earmarks of a satirical article, and yet not draw the obvious
conclusion?

Why did the article seem to be written in a deadpan style, so much so that
I detected no discernible punch line, therefore being led to think that perhaps
the resemblance to a satirical article was simply due to some sort of
clumsiness?

Because the site isn't just a satirical site; it's a _conservative_ satirical site.

So they weren't making fun of the character in the article for imagining in
his wildest dreams that politicians were coming for his faith.

No. They were making fun of Christians who looked down on other Christians
who did the "dirty work" of voting against politicians who were more likely to
outlaw Christianity... i.e. Trump voters. It's not surprising I would fail to see the
humor in that. So since the article seemed to only be bizarre without being funny,
despite its resemblance to a satire, that conclusion just didn't rise to a high enough
level for me to look around and see if it was a satirical site I was looking at.

John Savard
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-03-09 19:57:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
On Tuesday, March 9, 2021 at 6:02:32 AM UTC-7, Greg Weeks
On Tuesday, March 9, 2021 at 6:27:10 AM UTC-5, Quadibloc
On Monday, March 8, 2021 at 6:30:59 PM UTC-7, Ted Nolan
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whic
hever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illega
l
While I can imagine that many Trump voters held such
attitudes as expressed in the article, it read as though I
was reading The Onion.
It is a satire site after all.
Oh dear. Yes. After going to its front page, I see...
eBay pulls "Mein Kampf" upon discovery Hitler doodled Chinese
man with chopsticks in margins Jeep sues Cherokee tribe to
force them to change their name
and so on.
Ah. Further thought has permitted me to account for my...
previous muted reaction. Instead of immediately recognizing the
story as a satire, why did I notice some earmarks of a satirical
article, and yet not draw the obvious conclusion?
Why did the article seem to be written in a deadpan style, so
much so that I detected no discernible punch line, therefore
being led to think that perhaps the resemblance to a satirical
article was simply due to some sort of clumsiness?
There are two possibilities:

Either the extremists on both ends have become so ridiculous that
it's basically impossible to tell the difference between reality
and satire.

Or

With for it.

You're an idiot.
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Robert Carnegie
2021-03-10 09:22:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Greg Weeks
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
While I can imagine that many Trump voters held such attitudes as
expressed in the article, it read as though I was reading The Onion.
It is a satire site after all.
Oh dear. Yes. After going to its front page, I see...
eBay pulls "Mein Kampf" upon discovery Hitler doodled Chinese man with chopsticks in margins
Jeep sues Cherokee tribe to force them to change their name
and so on.
Ah. Further thought has permitted me to account for my... previous muted
reaction. Instead of immediately recognizing the story as a satire, why did
I notice some earmarks of a satirical article, and yet not draw the obvious
conclusion?
Why did the article seem to be written in a deadpan style, so much so that
I detected no discernible punch line, therefore being led to think that perhaps
the resemblance to a satirical article was simply due to some sort of
clumsiness?
Because the site isn't just a satirical site; it's a _conservative_ satirical site.
So they weren't making fun of the character in the article for imagining in
his wildest dreams that politicians were coming for his faith.
No. They were making fun of Christians who looked down on other Christians
who did the "dirty work" of voting against politicians who were more likely to
outlaw Christianity... i.e. Trump voters. It's not surprising I would fail to see the
humor in that. So since the article seemed to only be bizarre without being funny,
despite its resemblance to a satire, that conclusion just didn't rise to a high enough
level for me to look around and see if it was a satirical site I was looking at.
As I see it, Babylon Bee demonstrates that jokes can
be funny but don't /have/ to be. So, they're Christian,
but so was Torquemada.
Robert Carnegie
2021-03-10 21:00:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Greg Weeks
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
While I can imagine that many Trump voters held such attitudes as
expressed in the article, it read as though I was reading The Onion.
It is a satire site after all.
Oh dear. Yes. After going to its front page, I see...
eBay pulls "Mein Kampf" upon discovery Hitler doodled Chinese man with chopsticks in margins
Jeep sues Cherokee tribe to force them to change their name
and so on.
Ah. Further thought has permitted me to account for my... previous muted
reaction. Instead of immediately recognizing the story as a satire, why did
I notice some earmarks of a satirical article, and yet not draw the obvious
conclusion?
Why did the article seem to be written in a deadpan style, so much so that
I detected no discernible punch line, therefore being led to think that perhaps
the resemblance to a satirical article was simply due to some sort of
clumsiness?
Because the site isn't just a satirical site; it's a _conservative_ satirical site.
So they weren't making fun of the character in the article for imagining in
his wildest dreams that politicians were coming for his faith.
No. They were making fun of Christians who looked down on other Christians
who did the "dirty work" of voting against politicians who were more likely to
outlaw Christianity... i.e. Trump voters. It's not surprising I would fail to see the
humor in that. So since the article seemed to only be bizarre without being funny,
despite its resemblance to a satire, that conclusion just didn't rise to a high enough
level for me to look around and see if it was a satirical site I was looking at.
On reflection:

I may be only imagining that they are more conservative
than they were. I think there is more politics.

I just looked in and I got invited to subscribe by e-mail
because "big tech" is silencing conservative voices.
I think I won't. And, that would be by GMail - though I
do have my Yahoo! account not doing anything.

Since the story is on the front page but is dated 2017,
I think "18 Reasons The Rapture Will Be In 2018" was
intended to be less satirical than it now is.
Paul S Person
2021-03-09 17:55:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
https://babylonbee.com/news/christian-just-voting-for-whichever-political-party-less-likely-to-make-his-faith-illegal
While I can imagine that many Trump voters held such attitudes as
expressed in the article, it read as though I was reading The Onion.
However, while it's hard for me to imagine either the Democrats or
the Republicans making Christianity, _per se_, illegal, I can understand
that more conservative Christians may have some concerns. The
society in which they live is getting more and more hostile to forms of
Christianity that oppose abortion, that refuse to reconcile themselves
with equality for homosexuals, and that espouse Creationism.
Some of the "more conservative" Christians have imagined themselves to
be oppressed, persecuted, and fighting a culture war since Roe v Wade.
If not before.

"Nothing new here, folks, move along".
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
The Horny Goat
2021-03-09 07:09:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
Though in fairness I remain gobsmacked that a politician on his 3rd
wife having had his first two leave him due to infidelity could ever
be a hero to the religious right.
They got the Supreme Court judges they wanted. They were willing
to swallow anything for that, combined with DJT's lip service to
"Christian values." For the rest of the right, there was a tax cut.
Quite a few conservative voters wanted both. "Social issues" were
one reason I quit being a Republican 40+ years ago. I agreed with
Reagan on immigration and trade, and he cut deals with the Russians
on nukes that made the world safer. Today's "Republicans" wouldn't
nominate a "dangerous RINO" like that! :)
This is why though Trump was no tele-evangelist he's the closest thing
America has had to a real Nehemiah Scudder.

As for Reagan, America has always been built on pragmatists and maybe
I'm a minority but I've always admired Bush 41 for bringing about a
peaceful (mostly) transition through the end of the Cold War during an
era when there were more nukes in the world than any time before or
since.

He got a lot of flack for hiring Russian nuclear physicists but
realistically would any American (or citizen of an American ally) want
these people on Uncle Sam's payroll or in Pyongjang or Teheran or
Tripoli or other savory places like that? Which was VERY DEFINITELY a
possibility in 1989-90.

My daughter (who graduated honors history and was born in 1987) and I
often debate recent history and she is invariably pessimistic while I
am an optimist (at least on a grand scale though I don't expect to see
Vulcans descending to Earth any time soon) - she is focussed on
impending environmental catastrophe while I tell her that there are
now 15% as many nukes in this world as when she was born and if that
it not progress what is?
J. Clarke
2021-03-09 11:05:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Horny Goat
Post by Kevrob
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
Though in fairness I remain gobsmacked that a politician on his 3rd
wife having had his first two leave him due to infidelity could ever
be a hero to the religious right.
They got the Supreme Court judges they wanted. They were willing
to swallow anything for that, combined with DJT's lip service to
"Christian values." For the rest of the right, there was a tax cut.
Quite a few conservative voters wanted both. "Social issues" were
one reason I quit being a Republican 40+ years ago. I agreed with
Reagan on immigration and trade, and he cut deals with the Russians
on nukes that made the world safer. Today's "Republicans" wouldn't
nominate a "dangerous RINO" like that! :)
This is why though Trump was no tele-evangelist he's the closest thing
America has had to a real Nehemiah Scudder.
As for Reagan, America has always been built on pragmatists and maybe
I'm a minority but I've always admired Bush 41 for bringing about a
peaceful (mostly) transition through the end of the Cold War during an
era when there were more nukes in the world than any time before or
since.
He got a lot of flack for hiring Russian nuclear physicists but
realistically would any American (or citizen of an American ally) want
these people on Uncle Sam's payroll or in Pyongjang or Teheran or
Tripoli or other savory places like that? Which was VERY DEFINITELY a
possibility in 1989-90.
My daughter (who graduated honors history and was born in 1987) and I
often debate recent history and she is invariably pessimistic while I
am an optimist (at least on a grand scale though I don't expect to see
Vulcans descending to Earth any time soon) - she is focussed on
impending environmental catastrophe while I tell her that there are
now 15% as many nukes in this world as when she was born and if that
it not progress what is?
Since that time Pakistan and North Korea have obtained nuclear weapons
and Iran is working on it (I'll believe they aren't when they stop
insisting on having their own enrichment facilities). Given that
Pakistan can't control its own hinterlands, North Korea is run by
somebody who makes Trump look like Mother Theresa, and Iran is a
theocracy in which dying for Allah is a thing, this is not reassuring.
Paul S Person
2021-03-09 17:53:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:09:16 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Lynn McGuire
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
And therefore the issue is moot.
And that is how the story of "The Boy Who Cried Wolf" ended. I was hoping
for a *happy* ending in real life, since Trump really was a wolf, but he still
got kicked out.
It's not entirely implausible that if Heinlein had actually WRITTEN
the Scudder novel (and yes I remember his stated reasons why he
didn't) that America might have been spared Trump.
Though in fairness I remain gobsmacked that a politician on his 3rd
wife having had his first two leave him due to infidelity could ever
be a hero to the religious right.
One might almost say that he was, in fact, a hero to the "religious
wrong".
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
pyotr filipivich
2021-02-23 01:51:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Hamish Laws
Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers,
its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This
applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites,
or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what
is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages
for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the
publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is
worthy in and of itself."
Sounds like a principled stand to me.
No doubt it is. But incitement to violence is not protected speech, and on
January 6, 2021, we saw that this particular kind of incitement to violence
is not something that can merely be laughed off.
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
Yep. And the Main Stream Press will be completely baffled by his
election. After all, did they not warn their viewers of his
unacceptability?
Just as they did with Trump, Romney, John "Maverick" McCain,
Bushitler, etc, etc, unto the 10th generation.
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Us(tm) to serve as the new Them(tm)
Paul S Person
2021-02-23 17:29:42 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 17:51:19 -0800, pyotr filipivich
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Hamish Laws
Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers,
its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This
applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites,
or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what
is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages
for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the
publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is
worthy in and of itself."
Sounds like a principled stand to me.
No doubt it is. But incitement to violence is not protected speech, and on
January 6, 2021, we saw that this particular kind of incitement to violence
is not something that can merely be laughed off.
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
Yep. And the Main Stream Press will be completely baffled by his
election. After all, did they not warn their viewers of his
unacceptability?
Just as they did with Trump, Romney, John "Maverick" McCain,
Bushitler, etc, etc, unto the 10th generation.
If I understand your rather crabbed style, that leave Mainstream Media
with a 50% success rate.

This is a problem?
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
pyotr filipivich
2021-02-25 20:38:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 17:51:19 -0800, pyotr filipivich
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by pyotr filipivich
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Hamish Laws
Toni's response to calls for murder (including calls to get a cop killed)?
"It is not Baen Books’ policy to police the opinions of its readers,
its authors, its artists, its editors, or indeed anyone else. This
applies to posts at the Bar, or on social media, on their own websites,
or indeed anywhere else. On the Bar, the publisher does not select what
is allowed to be posted, and does not hijack an individual’s messages
for their own purposes. Similarly, the posts do not represent the
publisher’s opinion, except in a deep belief that free speech is
worthy in and of itself."
Sounds like a principled stand to me.
No doubt it is. But incitement to violence is not protected speech, and on
January 6, 2021, we saw that this particular kind of incitement to violence
is not something that can merely be laughed off.
Snerk. Having called every Republican candidate since Thomas
Dewey the latest incarnation of Hitler, what are the Democrat Party
Activists in the Corporate Media going to call a Nehemiah Scudder that
will have any meaning other than "He's not part of the Inner or Outer
Party"?
Nehemiah Scudder will shut down their activism and line up the
continuing activists against the wall.
Yep. And the Main Stream Press will be completely baffled by his
election. After all, did they not warn their viewers of his
unacceptability?
Just as they did with Trump, Romney, John "Maverick" McCain,
Bushitler, etc, etc, unto the 10th generation.
If I understand your rather crabbed style, that leave Mainstream Media
with a 50% success rate.
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent GOP
candidate, but at the time?
Post by Paul S Person
This is a problem?
Yep.

It's called "reliability". If half your prognostications have
been proven wrong, then how does one know if this new prognostication
is one of the correct ones, or one of the false ones?
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Us(tm) to serve as the new Them(tm)
The Horny Goat
2021-03-09 00:21:23 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
Post by pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent GOP
candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but America is
big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
Kevrob
2021-03-09 01:01:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent GOP
candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but America is
big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
The Birchers accused hi,m of being a Commie Dupe.

Eisenhower built the Interstate system, and A.H. is often credited with
building the Autobahn, so....*

DDE was inspired to create an effective national highway system after
taking part in a 1919 cross-country convoy.

https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/in-1919-dwight-d-eisenhower-suffered-through-historys-worst-cross-country-road-trip

Besides the benefits to commerce and other civilian transportation needs,
those roads were a defense measure. Not everything an Army needed could
be shipped by rail.


* Schickelgruber didn't actually start the project. He was agin ' it before
he was for it. See:

https://www.dw.com/en/the-myth-of-hitlers-role-in-building-the-autobahn/a-16144981
--
Kevin R
The Horny Goat
2021-03-09 07:15:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent GOP
candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but America is
big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
The Birchers accused hi,m of being a Commie Dupe.
Eisenhower built the Interstate system, and A.H. is often credited with
building the Autobahn, so....*
DDE was inspired to create an effective national highway system after
taking part in a 1919 cross-country convoy.
https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/in-1919-dwight-d-eisenhower-suffered-through-historys-worst-cross-country-road-trip
Besides the benefits to commerce and other civilian transportation needs,
those roads were a defense measure. Not everything an Army needed could
be shipped by rail.
* Schickelgruber didn't actually start the project. He was agin ' it before
https://www.dw.com/en/the-myth-of-hitlers-role-in-building-the-autobahn/a-16144981
The Birchers thought EVERYBODY (and I do mean everybody) who was not
with them was a Commie dupe or worse.

As for the autobahn one has to remember under what circumstances Ike
saw it and what he had to do to visit Germany.....to me the genius of
the Interstate system is the standardization of construction on the
one hand and signage on the other. This drew inspiration both from the
German system and other patterns like the London Tube system whose
stylized maps (now adopted by nearly every other subway system
worldwide) was developed in the 1930s. (As the TfL guide was happy to
point out 5 years ago when we were there)

Obviously the German autobahns were in less than prime condition when
Ike saw them and equally obviously you all know that the US and
British air and ground forces had a lot to do with that!
The Horny Goat
2021-03-09 07:19:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
DDE was inspired to create an effective national highway system after
taking part in a 1919 cross-country convoy.
Oh one more thing - if the 'cross-country convoy' is the one I think
you mean it was moving a single batallion (about 1000 men and all
equipment and vehicles) from Chicago to New Orleans - it DEFINITELY
wasn't from east coast to west coast or vice versa. CHI <-> MSY (which
believe it or not is the code for New Orleans but then the airport
code for St Petersberg Russia is still "LEN" and my daughter kept the
baggage tags from her trip there to prove it!)
J. Clarke
2021-03-09 11:14:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Horny Goat
Post by Kevrob
DDE was inspired to create an effective national highway system after
taking part in a 1919 cross-country convoy.
Oh one more thing - if the 'cross-country convoy' is the one I think
you mean it was moving a single batallion (about 1000 men and all
equipment and vehicles) from Chicago to New Orleans - it DEFINITELY
wasn't from east coast to west coast or vice versa. CHI <-> MSY (which
believe it or not is the code for New Orleans but then the airport
code for St Petersberg Russia is still "LEN" and my daughter kept the
baggage tags from her trip there to prove it!)
Googling "ike 1919 convoy" would have told you that it isn't the one
you are thinking of. The one in which Ike participated went from
Washington, DC to San Francisco and took 62 days.

<https://www.eisenhowerlibrary.gov/research/online-documents/1919-transcontinental-motor-convoy>
Kevrob
2021-03-09 12:22:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by The Horny Goat
Post by Kevrob
DDE was inspired to create an effective national highway system after
taking part in a 1919 cross-country convoy.
Oh one more thing - if the 'cross-country convoy' is the one I think
you mean it was moving a single batallion (about 1000 men and all
equipment and vehicles) from Chicago to New Orleans - it DEFINITELY
wasn't from east coast to west coast or vice versa. CHI <-> MSY
.....
If there's an account of that, I'd be interested in reading it.
Post by J. Clarke
Post by The Horny Goat
(which believe it or not is the code for New Orleans but then the airport
code for St Petersberg Russia is still "LEN" and my daughter kept the
baggage tags from her trip there to prove it!)
Googling "ike 1919 convoy" would have told you that it isn't the one
you are thinking of. The one in which Ike participated went from
Washington, DC to San Francisco and took 62 days.
<https://www.eisenhowerlibrary.gov/research/online-documents/1919-transcontinental-motor-convoy>
Alternately, THG could have opened the link that I posted.

https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/in-1919-dwight-d-eisenhower-suffered-through-historys-worst-cross-country-road-trip OR, graphics & ad-light version:

https://outline.com/xHEwsd

The Good Roads Movement is mentioned in the article.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_Roads_Movement
--
Kevin R
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2021-03-09 13:16:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Horny Goat
Post by Kevrob
DDE was inspired to create an effective national highway system after
taking part in a 1919 cross-country convoy.
Oh one more thing - if the 'cross-country convoy' is the one I think
you mean it was moving a single batallion (about 1000 men and all
equipment and vehicles) from Chicago to New Orleans - it DEFINITELY
wasn't from east coast to west coast or vice versa. CHI <-> MSY (which
believe it or not is the code for New Orleans but then the airport
code for St Petersberg Russia is still "LEN" and my daughter kept the
baggage tags from her trip there to prove it!)
Here's an article about it I read back in the day when AH still came to
our house:

https://www.americanheritage.com/ikes-excellent-adventure

[photo]

In 1919, future president Dwight D. Eisenhower traveled as
an army officer with the Motor Transport Corps convoy from
Washington, D.C., to San Francisco, using the incomplete
Lincoln Highway. Eisenhower Presidential Library

July 7, 1919 -- Three days after the Fourth of July, at the
Ellipse fronting the White House, a convoy of 81 vehicles
lined up, facing west. Flags flew. Bands played. The Secretary
of War hailed "the beginning of a new era." Finally, at
11:15 a.m., the convoy was ready for its perilous, uncharted
journey. The destination -- San Francisco.

For the previous half century, trains traveled coast-to-coast
in just a week. But by truck, the 3,200-mile slog was
expected to take. . . two months. With a roar of engines,
cheers from the crowd, and smiles from the 250 volunteer
adventurers, the Transcontinental Motor Convoy set out
across America.

This wild journey would be a historical footnote but for
one army officer along for the ride. His name was Eisenhower.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2021-03-09 13:19:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by The Horny Goat
Post by Kevrob
DDE was inspired to create an effective national highway system after
taking part in a 1919 cross-country convoy.
Oh one more thing - if the 'cross-country convoy' is the one I think
you mean it was moving a single batallion (about 1000 men and all
equipment and vehicles) from Chicago to New Orleans - it DEFINITELY
wasn't from east coast to west coast or vice versa. CHI <-> MSY (which
believe it or not is the code for New Orleans but then the airport
code for St Petersberg Russia is still "LEN" and my daughter kept the
baggage tags from her trip there to prove it!)
Here's an article about it I read back in the day when AH still came to
https://www.americanheritage.com/ikes-excellent-adventure
[photo]
In 1919, future president Dwight D. Eisenhower traveled as
an army officer with the Motor Transport Corps convoy from
Washington, D.C., to San Francisco, using the incomplete
Lincoln Highway. Eisenhower Presidential Library
July 7, 1919 -- Three days after the Fourth of July, at the
Ellipse fronting the White House, a convoy of 81 vehicles
lined up, facing west. Flags flew. Bands played. The Secretary
of War hailed "the beginning of a new era." Finally, at
11:15 a.m., the convoy was ready for its perilous, uncharted
journey. The destination -- San Francisco.
For the previous half century, trains traveled coast-to-coast
in just a week. But by truck, the 3,200-mile slog was
expected to take. . . two months. With a roar of engines,
cheers from the crowd, and smiles from the 250 volunteer
adventurers, the Transcontinental Motor Convoy set out
across America.
This wild journey would be a historical footnote but for
one army officer along for the ride. His name was Eisenhower.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Actually,

https://www.americanheritage.com/through-darkest-america

this is the article I read in 1993, though it's basically the same info
as the somewhat shorter one liked above.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Robert Carnegie
2021-03-10 09:19:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent GOP
candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but America is
big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.

It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
J. Clarke
2021-03-10 11:13:05 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:19:11 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent GOP
candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but America is
big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.
It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
I know it's mean-spirited of me, but I really wish that all the people
who say "X is Hitler" could experince a week in Dachau.

And when the next real Hitler arrives, people will be so used to
hearing that "X is Hitler" that they won't pay attention.
pyotr filipivich
2021-03-10 15:21:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:19:11 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent GOP
candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but America is
big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.
It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
I know it's mean-spirited of me, but I really wish that all the people
who say "X is Hitler" could experince a week in Dachau.
And when the next real Hitler arrives, people will be so used to
hearing that "X is Hitler" that they won't pay attention.
Exactly.

If everybody is $Expletive then no one is $Expletive.

But the Elite Corporate Press has so abused the languages, that
they have nothing left to use to warn of a "Nehemiah Scudder".

I was wondering if anyone would grasp the concept.
--
pyotr filipivich
This Week's Panel: Us & Them - Eliminating Them.
Next Month's Panel: Having eliminated the old Them(tm)
Selecting who insufficiently Woke(tm) as to serve as the new Them(tm)
Paul S Person
2021-03-10 17:35:49 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:13:05 -0500, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:19:11 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent GOP
candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but America is
big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.
It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
I know it's mean-spirited of me, but I really wish that all the people
who say "X is Hitler" could experince a week in Dachau.
And when the next real Hitler arrives, people will be so used to
hearing that "X is Hitler" that they won't pay attention.
The /real/ Hitler has come ... and gone.

Some worship him. Others despise him.

The /real/ question is: 80 years from now, will people feel the same
about Trump? Or will Trump have been relegated to the Ash Heap of
History?
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-03-10 18:12:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:13:05 -0500, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:19:11 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent
GOP candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but
America is big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.
It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
I know it's mean-spirited of me, but I really wish that all the
people who say "X is Hitler" could experince a week in Dachau.
And when the next real Hitler arrives, people will be so used to
hearing that "X is Hitler" that they won't pay attention.
The /real/ Hitler has come ... and gone.
Some worship him. Others despise him.
The /real/ question is: 80 years from now, will people feel the
same about Trump? Or will Trump have been relegated to the Ash
Heap of History?
Or will he get reelected in 2024 and go down in history as the
greatest President ever?

Or, perhaps, declare himself dictator, invest in a massive research
program, and still be ruling as a head in a jar?
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2021-03-10 19:26:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
Post by Paul S Person
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:13:05 -0500, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:19:11 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent
GOP candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but
America is big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.
It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
I know it's mean-spirited of me, but I really wish that all the
people who say "X is Hitler" could experince a week in Dachau.
And when the next real Hitler arrives, people will be so used to
hearing that "X is Hitler" that they won't pay attention.
The /real/ Hitler has come ... and gone.
Some worship him. Others despise him.
The /real/ question is: 80 years from now, will people feel the
same about Trump? Or will Trump have been relegated to the Ash
Heap of History?
Or will he get reelected in 2024 and go down in history as the
greatest President ever?
Or, perhaps, declare himself dictator, invest in a massive research
program, and still be ruling as a head in a jar?
Well, this is an SF group -- perhaps we will all be around to see.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-03-10 20:14:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
Post by Paul S Person
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:13:05 -0500, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:19:11 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
On Tuesday, 9 March 2021 at 00:21:29 UTC, The Horny Goat
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not
one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent
GOP candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but
America is big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.
It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
I know it's mean-spirited of me, but I really wish that all
the people who say "X is Hitler" could experince a week in
Dachau.
And when the next real Hitler arrives, people will be so used
to hearing that "X is Hitler" that they won't pay attention.
The /real/ Hitler has come ... and gone.
Some worship him. Others despise him.
The /real/ question is: 80 years from now, will people feel
the same about Trump? Or will Trump have been relegated to the
Ash Heap of History?
Or will he get reelected in 2024 and go down in history as the
greatest President ever?
Or, perhaps, declare himself dictator, invest in a massive
research program, and still be ruling as a head in a jar?
Well, this is an SF group -- perhaps we will all be around to
see.
As heads in jars?
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2021-03-10 22:23:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
Post by Paul S Person
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:13:05 -0500, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:19:11 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
On Tuesday, 9 March 2021 at 00:21:29 UTC, The Horny Goat
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not
one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any subsequent
GOP candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler but
America is big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.
It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
I know it's mean-spirited of me, but I really wish that all
the people who say "X is Hitler" could experince a week in
Dachau.
And when the next real Hitler arrives, people will be so used
to hearing that "X is Hitler" that they won't pay attention.
The /real/ Hitler has come ... and gone.
Some worship him. Others despise him.
The /real/ question is: 80 years from now, will people feel
the same about Trump? Or will Trump have been relegated to the
Ash Heap of History?
Or will he get reelected in 2024 and go down in history as the
greatest President ever?
Or, perhaps, declare himself dictator, invest in a massive
research program, and still be ruling as a head in a jar?
Well, this is an SF group -- perhaps we will all be around to
see.
As heads in jars?
Nimoy made it look so appealing!
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-03-10 22:09:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
Post by Paul S Person
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:13:05 -0500, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
On Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:19:11 -0800 (PST), Robert Carnegie
On Tuesday, 9 March 2021 at 00:21:29 UTC, The Horny Goat
Post by The Horny Goat
On Thu, 25 Feb 2021 12:38:35 -0800, pyotr filipivich
So which one's were not the incarnation of Hitler? Not one who
was rehabilitated for speaking out against any
subsequent GOP candidate, but at the time?
I can't imagine anyone actually comparing Ike to Hitler
but America is big enough probably SOMEBODY did!
I say anyone who compares (not contrasts) X to Hitler,
when in fact X /fought/ Hitler (if rarely in person), loses
ten points.
It doesn't happen often, but more than I'd like, and it
bespeaks incuriosity about who Hitler actually was,
and who X was or is.
I know it's mean-spirited of me, but I really wish that all
the people who say "X is Hitler" could experince a week in
Dachau.
And when the next real Hitler arrives, people will be so
used to hearing that "X is Hitler" that they won't pay
attention.
The /real/ Hitler has come ... and gone.
Some worship him. Others despise him.
The /real/ question is: 80 years from now, will people feel
the same about Trump? Or will Trump have been relegated to
the Ash Heap of History?
Or will he get reelected in 2024 and go down in history as the
greatest President ever?
Or, perhaps, declare himself dictator, invest in a massive
research program, and still be ruling as a head in a jar?
Well, this is an SF group -- perhaps we will all be around to see.
As heads in jars?
Nimoy made it look so appealing!
I seem to recall Futurama made extensive use of the idea (though I
never really watched the show, so maybe it was only in the handful
of episodes I've seen).
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Jonathan
2021-02-21 01:31:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
https://gunfreezone.net/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon-monster-hunter-nation/
Lynn
Considering the letter had what 80 profanities I'd say
it was written by a bitter Trumpster about the current phase
of purging extremist outlets that support violence to install
the fascist Trump for life.

'Cancel Culture' is a term used by racist, violent
white supremacists that object to not being able
to shoot blacks at will, just for the fun of it.

And worship autocrat Trump that attempted to turn America
into just another Russia.

Putin and Trump sittin' in a tree....


The public at large, not just this sci-fi convention
is turning their backs on such extremism, and for
good reason.

Trump has an approval rating of 25%, Nixon bottomed at 24%.
Trump is polling as the worst president ever and 'By a Lot'
to use Trump's favorite term.


A staggering 42% replied Trump is the worst president ever.
Another 10% rated Trump below average.
While only 22% gave him the highest rating.

To put that 42% in perspective, the average of all
presidents in the worst category is 14%.
Trump is...28% below the average for all presidents.


Worst ratings


HW Bush 4%
Ford 7%
Carter 15%
Obama 17%
GW Bush 36%

https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/20/politics/trump-presidency-history-analysis/index.html

Congrats repubs for giving America the two worst presidents
since the US Civil War.

The Great Economic Collapse of 2008 happened as GW Bush left office.
(36%)

And Trump gave us the greatest economic collapse since 1929
and half a million dead in the wake of "Herd Immunity' COVID
strategy of infecting as many as possible.
(42%)

Way to go repubs.







Jonathan


s
--
https://twitter.com/Non_Linear1
Quadibloc
2021-02-21 05:45:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jonathan
Congrats repubs for giving America the two worst presidents
since the US Civil War.
The Great Economic Collapse of 2008 happened as GW Bush left office.
(36%)
And Trump gave us the greatest economic collapse since 1929
and half a million dead in the wake of "Herd Immunity' COVID
strategy of infecting as many as possible.
(42%)
Way to go repubs.
And here I thought you meant *Nixon* and Trump. (The economic collapse
of 2008, which led to Obama's victory, was mostly due to Republicans in
Congress, I thought.)

John Savard
Jonathan
2021-02-21 12:37:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Jonathan
Congrats repubs for giving America the two worst presidents
since the US Civil War.
The Great Economic Collapse of 2008 happened as GW Bush left office.
(36%)
And Trump gave us the greatest economic collapse since 1929
and half a million dead in the wake of "Herd Immunity' COVID
strategy of infecting as many as possible.
(42%)
Way to go repubs.
And here I thought you meant *Nixon* and Trump. (The economic collapse
of 2008, which led to Obama's victory, was mostly due to Republicans in
Congress, I thought.)
John Savard
It was a 'feel good' rant, sometimes once I get
started I'm not sure what I meant.

Ut oh...feel another coming on~

The way I read the Great Crash of '08, banking and
housing policies originally installed under democrats
ended up being badly abused during GW Bush, and the
republicans utterly failed with Congressional oversight
and let the problem get completely out of hand.

I'm all in with blaming a previous administration for
their policy mistakes, but after a year maybe two
at most the new administration owns the problems
if they do nothing about it.

Same goes for taking credit, Trump took credit for
the Obama recovery. All Trump did was bubble that
recovery with his huge tax cuts. And we're paying
for it now.

Obama's slow but long running recovery, second longest
ever after the Clinton recovery, was the way
to end the boom and bust cycle that leads to
one recession after another and allows the
economy to build in a healthy and lasting way.

Remember at the end of the Clinton administration
we had budget surpluses that were exploding, and
Obama ended with sharply declining deficits.

Trump screwed that over big time with his deliberate
and politically motivated COVID incompetence.

But we're lucky, interest on the national debt is
so low borrowing money now is a bargain.
The increase in GDP and inflation will eat the
debt away over time.

America always wins in the end.
--
https://twitter.com/Non_Linear1
Paul S Person
2021-02-21 17:28:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jonathan
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
https://gunfreezone.net/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon-monster-hunter-nation/
Lynn
Considering the letter had what 80 profanities I'd say
it was written by a bitter Trumpster about the current phase
of purging extremist outlets that support violence to install
the fascist Trump for life.
'Cancel Culture' is a term used by racist, violent
white supremacists that object to not being able
to shoot blacks at will, just for the fun of it.
I read an article the other day reporting that some Republicans are
characterizing the sanctions on Republicans who voted to impeach
(House) or convict (Senate) Trump as examples of "cancel culture".

So, apparently, the concept is turning on itself.
Post by Jonathan
And worship autocrat Trump that attempted to turn America
into just another Russia.
Putin and Trump sittin' in a tree....
The public at large, not just this sci-fi convention
is turning their backs on such extremism, and for
good reason.
Trump has an approval rating of 25%, Nixon bottomed at 24%.
Trump is polling as the worst president ever and 'By a Lot'
to use Trump's favorite term.
A staggering 42% replied Trump is the worst president ever.
Another 10% rated Trump below average.
While only 22% gave him the highest rating.
To put that 42% in perspective, the average of all
presidents in the worst category is 14%.
Trump is...28% below the average for all presidents.
Worst ratings
HW Bush 4%
Ford 7%
Carter 15%
Obama 17%
GW Bush 36%
https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/20/politics/trump-presidency-history-analysis/index.html
Congrats repubs for giving America the two worst presidents
since the US Civil War.
The Great Economic Collapse of 2008 happened as GW Bush left office.
(36%)
And Trump gave us the greatest economic collapse since 1929
and half a million dead in the wake of "Herd Immunity' COVID
strategy of infecting as many as possible.
(42%)
Way to go repubs.
Jonathan
s
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Jonathan
2021-02-21 19:10:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Jonathan
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
https://gunfreezone.net/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon-monster-hunter-nation/
Lynn
Considering the letter had what 80 profanities I'd say
it was written by a bitter Trumpster about the current phase
of purging extremist outlets that support violence to install
the fascist Trump for life.
'Cancel Culture' is a term used by racist, violent
white supremacists that object to not being able
to shoot blacks at will, just for the fun of it.
I read an article the other day reporting that some Republicans are
characterizing the sanctions on Republicans who voted to impeach
(House) or convict (Senate) Trump as examples of "cancel culture".
Interesting, I didn't know that.

I have several coworkers that are devoted Trumpsters, and a
couple of them confided to me no one believes in the QAnon
conspiracies, but espousing them is really a loyalty oath
to Trump and his ideology.

Apparently to an ideology that can't be spoken out loud
such as white supremacy.

Kinda like Sieg Heil was a sign of obedience to Hitler.
Not kinda like, exactly like.
Post by Paul S Person
So, apparently, the concept is turning on itself.
The term started I believe with the movement
to take down Confederate symbols.

Republicans took great offense to any slight
of their beloved Dixie, as that is what they
thought 'Make America Great...Again' was
all about.

Bringing back the good ol' days of white supremacy.
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Jonathan
And worship autocrat Trump that attempted to turn America
into just another Russia.
Putin and Trump sittin' in a tree....
The public at large, not just this sci-fi convention
is turning their backs on such extremism, and for
good reason.
Trump has an approval rating of 25%, Nixon bottomed at 24%.
Trump is polling as the worst president ever and 'By a Lot'
to use Trump's favorite term.
A staggering 42% replied Trump is the worst president ever.
Another 10% rated Trump below average.
While only 22% gave him the highest rating.
To put that 42% in perspective, the average of all
presidents in the worst category is 14%.
Trump is...28% below the average for all presidents.
Worst ratings
HW Bush 4%
Ford 7%
Carter 15%
Obama 17%
GW Bush 36%
https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/20/politics/trump-presidency-history-analysis/index.html
Congrats repubs for giving America the two worst presidents
since the US Civil War.
The Great Economic Collapse of 2008 happened as GW Bush left office.
(36%)
And Trump gave us the greatest economic collapse since 1929
and half a million dead in the wake of "Herd Immunity' COVID
strategy of infecting as many as possible.
(42%)
Way to go repubs.
Jonathan
s
--
https://twitter.com/Non_Linear1
Andrew McDowell
2021-02-21 19:39:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jonathan
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Jonathan
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
https://gunfreezone.net/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon-monster-hunter-nation/
Lynn
Considering the letter had what 80 profanities I'd say
it was written by a bitter Trumpster about the current phase
of purging extremist outlets that support violence to install
the fascist Trump for life.
'Cancel Culture' is a term used by racist, violent
white supremacists that object to not being able
to shoot blacks at will, just for the fun of it.
I read an article the other day reporting that some Republicans are
characterizing the sanctions on Republicans who voted to impeach
(House) or convict (Senate) Trump as examples of "cancel culture".
Interesting, I didn't know that.
I have several coworkers that are devoted Trumpsters, and a
couple of them confided to me no one believes in the QAnon
conspiracies, but espousing them is really a loyalty oath
to Trump and his ideology.
Apparently to an ideology that can't be spoken out loud
such as white supremacy.
Kinda like Sieg Heil was a sign of obedience to Hitler.
Not kinda like, exactly like.
Post by Paul S Person
So, apparently, the concept is turning on itself.
The term started I believe with the movement
to take down Confederate symbols.
Republicans took great offense to any slight
of their beloved Dixie, as that is what they
thought 'Make America Great...Again' was
all about.
Bringing back the good ol' days of white supremacy.
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Jonathan
And worship autocrat Trump that attempted to turn America
into just another Russia.
Putin and Trump sittin' in a tree....
As an example of people not previously deemed unacceptable complaining about Cancel culture I quote the open letter at https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate of which I include a portion for taste

The free exchange of information and ideas, the lifeblood of a liberal society, is daily becoming more constricted. While we have come to expect this on the radical right, censoriousness is also spreading more widely in our culture: an intolerance of opposing views, a vogue for public shaming and ostracism, and the tendency to dissolve complex policy issues in a blinding moral certainty. We uphold the value of robust and even caustic counter-speech from all quarters. But it is now all too common to hear calls for swift and severe retribution in response to perceived transgressions of speech and thought. More troubling still, institutional leaders, in a spirit of panicked damage control, are delivering hasty and disproportionate punishments instead of considered reforms. Editors are fired for running controversial pieces; books are withdrawn for alleged inauthenticity; journalists are barred from writing on certain topics; professors are investigated for quoting works of literature in class;

Of the many signatories, those on topic here include Margaret Atwood, J.K.Rowling, and Salman Rushdie
Jonathan
2021-02-21 21:38:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by Jonathan
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Jonathan
Post by Lynn McGuire
"An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon" by Larry Correia
https://monsterhunternation.com/2021/02/19/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon/
"Dear WorldCon,"
"You are cowards."
"Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a
bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable
outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher,
Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the
controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and
tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you
have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again."
Real men do not treat ladies like this.
https://gunfreezone.net/an-open-letter-to-the-old-time-fans-at-worldcon-monster-hunter-nation/
Lynn
Considering the letter had what 80 profanities I'd say
it was written by a bitter Trumpster about the current phase
of purging extremist outlets that support violence to install
the fascist Trump for life.
'Cancel Culture' is a term used by racist, violent
white supremacists that object to not being able
to shoot blacks at will, just for the fun of it.
I read an article the other day reporting that some Republicans are
characterizing the sanctions on Republicans who voted to impeach
(House) or convict (Senate) Trump as examples of "cancel culture".
Interesting, I didn't know that.
I have several coworkers that are devoted Trumpsters, and a
couple of them confided to me no one believes in the QAnon
conspiracies, but espousing them is really a loyalty oath
to Trump and his ideology.
Apparently to an ideology that can't be spoken out loud
such as white supremacy.
Kinda like Sieg Heil was a sign of obedience to Hitler.
Not kinda like, exactly like.
Post by Paul S Person
So, apparently, the concept is turning on itself.
The term started I believe with the movement
to take down Confederate symbols.
Republicans took great offense to any slight
of their beloved Dixie, as that is what they
thought 'Make America Great...Again' was
all about.
Bringing back the good ol' days of white supremacy.
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Jonathan
And worship autocrat Trump that attempted to turn America
into just another Russia.
Putin and Trump sittin' in a tree....
As an example of people not previously deemed unacceptable complaining about Cancel culture I quote the open letter at https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate of which I include a portion for taste
The free exchange of information and ideas, the lifeblood of a liberal society, is daily becoming more constricted. While we have come to expect this on the radical right, censoriousness is also spreading more widely in our culture: an intolerance of opposing views, a vogue for public shaming and ostracism, and the tendency to dissolve complex policy issues in a blinding moral certainty. We uphold the value of robust and even caustic counter-speech from all quarters. But it is now all too common to hear calls for swift and severe retribution in response to perceived transgressions of speech and thought. More troubling still, institutional leaders, in a spirit of panicked damage control, are delivering hasty and disproportionate punishments instead of considered reforms. Editors are fired for running controversial pieces; books are withdrawn for alleged inauthenticity; journalists are barred from writing on certain topics; professors are investigated for quoting works of literature in class;
Of the many signatories, those on topic here include Margaret Atwood, J.K.Rowling, and Salman Rushdie
I agree the current 'purge' of extremist beliefs can get out of control
and spill over into legitimate speech, extreme or not.

But America just experienced a movement that is an existential threat
to the America we all know and love, the America that cherishes
tolerance and freedom, and fights to defend even the most extreme
ideas.

It's easy to dismiss the MAGA movement as just right wing thought
where a few got out of hand.

The movement is far more sinister.

The following political ideologies clearly define Trump and his
movement. And they also define another movement that literally
burned the world to the ground 80 years ago.

The rise of the MAGA movement needs to be understood clearly
for what it is, and denounced in the most certain way possible.

Here's why...

DON'T CLOSE YOUR EYES READ BELOW....

Trump is a Hitler/Mussolini fascist for four reasons that are
indisputable. The heart-and-soul of fascism and dictatorships
are these four tactics, Trump has doubled-down on every single
primary aspect.




1) The Big Lie

2) The Cult of Personality

3) Demonizing an entire population to hate
and blame for the nation's problems

4) Neo-fascist political strategy



Trump practices Hitler's Big Lie


Big lie
From Wikipedia

A big lie is a propaganda technique used for political purpose,
defined as, "a gross distortion or misrepresentation of the
facts"...

The expression was coined by Adolf Hitler, when he
dictated his 1925 book Mein Kampf, to describe the
use of a lie so "colossal" that no one would believe
that someone "could have the impudence to distort the truth
so infamously".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_lie



Trump practices the Cult of Personality

Cult of personality
From Wikipedia,

A cult of personality, or cult of the leader,[1] arises when
a country's regime – or, more rarely, an individual –
uses the techniques of mass media, propaganda, the big lie,
spectacle, the arts, patriotism, and government-organized
demonstrations and rallies to create an idealized, heroic,
and worshipful image of a leader, often through unquestioning
flattery and praise.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult_of_personality


Trump has been as relentless in demonizing undocumented immigrants
as Hitler was in demonizing the Jews. Casting them as rapists
and murderers and drug dealers, blaming them for all the nation's
problems, fomenting hate against them without regard to
anything.

"And I suppose a few are good people".

Trump said about illegal immigrants.
A FEW! Is that more than a couple, but less
than some?


Trump practices the political strategy of neo-fascism
as pioneered by Mussolini and perfected by Hitler.

Did Trump miss even a single bullet point???


Neo-fascism
From Wikipedia,


Neo-fascism is a post-World War II ideology that includes
significant elements of fascism. Neo-fascism usually
includes...

ultranationalism,
racial supremacy,
populism,
authoritarianism,
nativism,
xenophobia and
anti-immigration sentiment as well as
opposition to liberal democracy,
parliamentarianism,
liberalism,
Marxism,
communism and
socialism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-fascism



"Those who do not know history's mistakes are doomed
to repeat it"

~ George Santayana



For instance, the world looking the other way as
Assad and Putin slaughtered the Syrian people.

You won't find a more extensive photographic record
of the crimes against humanity they committed then
on my Twitter site below. I collected each and every
one of those pics, and are saving them for the day
Assad or Putin face judgement in court.

God willing.

We must be uncompromising when it comes to such things.


--
https://tw
Quadibloc
2021-02-22 22:43:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew McDowell
As an example of people not previously deemed unacceptable complaining about Cancel culture I quote the open letter at https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate of which I include a portion for taste
The free exchange of information and ideas, the lifeblood of a liberal society, is daily becoming more constricted. While we have come to expect this on the radical right, censoriousness is also spreading more widely in our culture: an intolerance of opposing views, a vogue for public shaming and ostracism, and the tendency to dissolve complex policy issues in a blinding moral certainty. We uphold the value of robust and even caustic counter-speech from all quarters. But it is now all too common to hear calls for swift and severe retribution in response to perceived transgressions of speech and thought. More troubling still, institutional leaders, in a spirit of panicked damage control, are delivering hasty and disproportionate punishments instead of considered reforms. Editors are fired for running controversial pieces; books are withdrawn for alleged inauthenticity; journalists are barred from writing on certain topics; professors are investigated for quoting works of literature in class;
Of the many signatories, those on topic here include Margaret Atwood, J.K.Rowling, and Salman Rushdie
The letter is dated July 7, 2020. I thought it was several years older than that.

I agree with the general sentiment, but a hostile reaction to actual racism instead of
mere wrongthink doesn't seem to be surprising. People shouldn't live in fear of
expressing the wrong opinion, but it is proper to hold people accountable for spreading
lies. And right now, we've had a lot of lies. Lies about the election, lies about global
warming, lies about the pandemic. All lies that have a real threat of killing people.

In the context of recent events, therefore, an attempt by people whose lies have killed
to escape accountability can be disguised as a plea for tolerance. That's the stunt
Gina Carano tried to pull.

John Savard
Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
2021-02-22 22:18:55 UTC
Permalink
On Sunday, February 21, 2021 at 12:39:43 PM UTC-7,
Post by Andrew McDowell
As an example of people not previously deemed unacceptable
complaining ab
out Cancel culture I quote the open letter at
https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate of which
I include a portion for taste
Post by Andrew McDowell
The free exchange of information and ideas, the lifeblood of a
liberal so
ciety, is daily becoming more constricted. While we have come to
expect this on the radical right, censoriousness is also
spreading more widely in our culture: an intolerance of opposing
views, a vogue for public shaming and ostracism, and the
tendency to dissolve complex policy issues in a blinding moral
certainty. We uphold the value of robust and even caustic
counter-speech from all quarters. But it is now all too common
to hear calls for swift and severe retribution in response to
perceived transgressions of speech and thought. More troubling
still, institutional leaders, in a spirit of panicked damage
control, are delivering hasty and disproportionate punishments
instead of considered reforms. Editors are fired for running
controversial pieces; books are withdrawn for alleged
inauthenticity; journalists are barred from writing on certain
topics; professors are investigated for quoting works of
literature in class;
Post by Andrew McDowell
Of the many signatories, those on topic here include Margaret
Atwood, J.K
.Rowling, and Salman Rushdie
The letter is dated July 7, 2020. I thought it was several years older than that.
I agree with the general sentiment, but a hostile reaction to
actual racism instead of mere wrongthink doesn't seem to be
surprising. People shouldn't live in fear of expressing the
wrong opinion, but it is proper to hold people accountable for
spreading lies. And right now, we've had a lot of lies. Lies
about the election, lies about global warming, lies about the
pandemic. All lies that have a real threat of killing people.
And you would, of course, not being a raging hypocrite, agree that
teh same punishments should be meted out fo those who lie on the
left, like claiming that a four year old violent insurgency by BLM
and Antifa fascists are "peaceful protests."

Of course you do.
--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB
Alan Baker
2021-02-22 23:26:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha
On Sunday, February 21, 2021 at 12:39:43 PM UTC-7,
Post by Andrew McDowell
As an example of people not previously deemed unacceptable
complaining ab
out Cancel culture I quote the open letter at
https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate of which
I include a portion for taste
Post by Andrew McDowell
The free exchange of information and ideas, the lifeblood of a
liberal so
ciety, is daily becoming more constricted. While we have come to
expect this on the radical right, censoriousness is also
spreading more widely in our culture: an intolerance of opposing
views, a vogue for public shaming and ostracism, and the
tendency to dissolve complex policy issues in a blinding moral
certainty. We uphold the value of robust and even caustic
counter-speech from all quarters. But it is now all too common
to hear calls for swift and severe retribution in response to
perceived transgressions of speech and thought. More troubling
still, institutional leaders, in a spirit of panicked damage
control, are delivering hasty and disproportionate punishments
instead of considered reforms. Editors are fired for running
controversial pieces; books are withdrawn for alleged
inauthenticity; journalists are barred from writing on certain
topics; professors are investigated for quoting works of
literature in class;
Post by Andrew McDowell
Of the many signatories, those on topic here include Margaret
Atwood, J.K
.Rowling, and Salman Rushdie
The letter is dated July 7, 2020. I thought it was several years older than that.
I agree with the general sentiment, but a hostile reaction to
actual racism instead of mere wrongthink doesn't seem to be
surprising. People shouldn't live in fear of expressing the
wrong opinion, but it is proper to hold people accountable for
spreading lies. And right now, we've had a lot of lies. Lies
about the election, lies about global warming, lies about the
pandemic. All lies that have a real threat of killing people.
And you would, of course, not being a raging hypocrite, agree that
teh same punishments should be meted out fo those who lie on the
left, like claiming that a four year old violent insurgency by BLM
and Antifa fascists are "peaceful protests."
Of course you do.
You're deeply delusional.
Paul S Person
2021-02-23 17:32:27 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 22 Feb 2021 14:43:58 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Andrew McDowell
Post by Andrew McDowell
As an example of people not previously deemed unacceptable complaining about Cancel culture I quote the open letter at https://harpers.org/a-letter-on-justice-and-open-debate of which I include a portion for taste
The free exchange of information and ideas, the lifeblood of a liberal society, is daily becoming more constricted. While we have come to expect this on the radical right, censoriousness is also spreading more widely in our culture: an intolerance of opposing views, a vogue for public shaming and ostracism, and the tendency to dissolve complex policy issues in a blinding moral certainty. We uphold the value of robust and even caustic counter-speech from all quarters. But it is now all too common to hear calls for swift and severe retribution in response to perceived transgressions of speech and thought. More troubling still, institutional leaders, in a spirit of panicked damage control, are delivering hasty and disproportionate punishments instead of considered reforms. Editors are fired for running controversial pieces; books are withdrawn for alleged inauthenticity; journalists are barred from writing on certain topics; professors are investigated for quoting works of literature
in class;
Post by Andrew McDowell
Of the many signatories, those on topic here include Margaret Atwood, J.K.Rowling, and Salman Rushdie
The letter is dated July 7, 2020. I thought it was several years older than that.
I agree with the general sentiment, but a hostile reaction to actual racism instead of
mere wrongthink doesn't seem to be surprising. People shouldn't live in fear of
expressing the wrong opinion, but it is proper to hold people accountable for spreading
lies. And right now, we've had a lot of lies. Lies about the election, lies about global
warming, lies about the pandemic. All lies that have a real threat of killing people.
In the context of recent events, therefore, an attempt by people whose lies have killed
to escape accountability can be disguised as a plea for tolerance. That's the stunt
Gina Carano tried to pull.
Well, what else can they do except rely on the people they have been
attacking so viciously to actually be as weak as they believed them to
be?

Still, everyone backing down two steps would be helpful. The problem
is, those most insistant on everybody doing so have a long record of
not doing so themselves.

Perhaps they should set the example ...
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
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