Discussion:
weather disaster predictions
(too old to reply)
David DeLaney
2020-01-04 01:42:42 UTC
Permalink
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.

Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
--
\/David DeLaney posting thru EarthLink - "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
my gatekeeper archives are no longer accessible :( / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Lynn McGuire
2020-01-04 01:56:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
LHC == Lee Harvey Cthulhu ?

Lynn
p***@hotmail.com
2020-01-04 02:27:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
LHC == Lee Harvey Cthulhu ?
Large Hadron Collider?

Peter Wezeman
anti-social Darwinist
Quadibloc
2020-01-05 04:56:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by David DeLaney
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
LHC == Lee Harvey Cthulhu ?
Large Hadron Collider?
Well, of course.

John Savard
h***@gmail.com
2020-01-04 02:10:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
climate change => hotter, drier conditions => fires more likely to take off and burn with more intensity

Increased fires and increased fire intensity have been predictions for a long time.

Ex-firefighter chiefs have been attempting to meet with the PM to raise the alarm since April/May due to the forecasts. The PM is an evangelical climate change denier so refused to meet them.
(He also flew out on a secret holiday to Hawaii while the bushfires were raging, he's also just done a 'comfort stop' where he's disgraced himself with a complete lack of empathy)

The Labor party (our leftish wing major party) went to the last election with a big purchase of more equipment for fire fighting due to the predicted bad conditions.
Alan Baker
2020-01-04 03:41:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the
literature that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would
be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
climate change => hotter, drier conditions => fires more likely to
take off and burn with more intensity
Actually... ...that simple, linear connection claim is giving ammunition
to those who woul—even definite change to a warmer earth overall—does
NOT mean that everywhere will experience "hotter, drier conditions".

Additional heat in the system will result in some areas experiencing that...

...but some places will get wetter...

...some places will get colder.
Titus G
2020-01-04 04:01:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
Quadibloc
2020-01-05 05:00:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.

The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.

John Savard
m***@sky.com
2020-01-05 05:36:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
John Savard
FWIW https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bible_and_homosexuality illustrates ways of reinterpreting what the bible says. Whether this tells you more about the bible or about Wikipedia is another question. Of course, the bible also includes many perfectly reasonable condemnations, such as against telling lies, without necessarily implying that everybody who has ever told a lie will burn in hell forever.
Quadibloc
2020-01-05 08:21:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@sky.com
Of course, the bible also includes many perfectly reasonable condemnations, such
as against telling lies, without necessarily implying that everybody who has
ever told a lie will burn in hell forever.
It is true that the doctrine that everyone who has committed any sin, no matter
how minor, will burn in Hell for all eternity, unless he repents and recieves
Jesus Christ as his personal Saviour... is separate from the places in the Bible
where various actions are described as sinful.

That doctrine, though, while not universally accepted by all Christian
denominations, can't really be claimed to have been tortured or twisted out of
the Bible either. It is a fairly reasonable interpretation of a limited number
of well-known Biblical texts.

John Savard
Paul S Person
2020-01-05 18:30:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by m***@sky.com
Of course, the bible also includes many perfectly reasonable condemnations, such
as against telling lies, without necessarily implying that everybody who has
ever told a lie will burn in hell forever.
It is true that the doctrine that everyone who has committed any sin, no matter
how minor, will burn in Hell for all eternity, unless he repents and recieves
Jesus Christ as his personal Saviour... is separate from the places in the Bible
where various actions are described as sinful.
Not always:
Revelation 21:8 ESV

But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for
murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars,
their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur,
which is the second death.

Note that "homosexuals" are not explicitly mentioned; they generally
are. But taking "the sexually immoral" as including them is not much
of a stretch. It is, however, still a stretch since the normal pattern
is to mention them explicitly. Equating this lake with Hell is, of
course, a traditional and common inference.
Post by Quadibloc
That doctrine, though, while not universally accepted by all Christian
denominations, can't really be claimed to have been tortured or twisted out of
the Bible either. It is a fairly reasonable interpretation of a limited number
of well-known Biblical texts.
The problem here is an abundance of versions: Gehenna (Jerusalem's
garbage dump), Hell/Hades (Greco-Roman), a lake of fire, a pit, the
outer darkness, the New Earth outside the New Jerusalem (Rev 21:15),
Sheol (the grave) ... all somehow mashed together with popular
beliefs.

Not to mention the occasional interpretation of "forever" as "until I
die" or "until the end of the present age" instead of "outside of
time".

This stuff doesn't get any clearer as time goes on, BTW.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
h***@gmail.com
2020-01-05 10:48:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
The bible condemns homosexual acts in the old testament, along with eating shellfish and in one of the post-jesus authors Timothy iirc.
He also is in favour of slavery and genocide.

And that's ignoring questions about the translation, I believe there's some debate about whether the original text is referring to sex with boys rather than sex between consenting adults.
Paul S Person
2020-01-05 18:40:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
The bible condemns homosexual acts in the old testament, along with eating shellfish and in one of the post-jesus authors Timothy iirc.
He also is in favour of slavery and genocide.
And that's ignoring questions about the translation, I believe there's some debate about whether the original text is referring to sex with boys rather than sex between consenting adults.
Back in the early 70s, IIRC, the story of one word usually translated
by some form of "homosexual" (used by Paul) was this:
1. whatever it was, it was condemned by God
2. it was on a list of items condemned by God
3. it was in close proximity to heterosexual activities condemned by
God, suggesting a sexual context
4. it was used, in the entire canon of Koine writings known to that
point, used exactly once -- here
5. analyzing the roots ... did not help as much as might be hoped

It is very hard to tell what a word means from a list; they really
need to be used in context or (preferably) a dictionary.

Analysis of roots can be halpful, but tricky: if we did not know what
"understand" means and analyzed its roots, might we not conclude that
it meant "stands under" or "has less height"?

And, while /we/ distinguish pederasty from homosexuality, the ancients
(and not so ancients -- consider Kazantzakis' /The Greek Passion/) may
not have. Children, after all, were property -- as they always are
under Tradtional Family Values. This is why the adjective "liber",
which means "free", was used for "boy": it was applied to free-born
boys, who one day would be "liber" indeed.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Paul S Person
2020-01-05 18:18:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
Two points:

1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things up, but
because they /never mention the other things condemned along with
homosexuality/. In particular, we /never/ hear how "liars will spend
an eternity in hell", although that is just as Biblical. It is their
/bias/ that shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that
causes them to be selective.

2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
an eternity in hell. It appears that my memory is correct for once:
the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a reasonable
inference from things the Bible /does/ say that those who are not in
Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an inference does not have the
authority of a direct statement.

BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality are also
condemned. The two are consistently paired.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
m***@sky.com
2020-01-06 05:39:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things up, but
because they /never mention the other things condemned along with
homosexuality/. In particular, we /never/ hear how "liars will spend
an eternity in hell", although that is just as Biblical. It is their
/bias/ that shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that
causes them to be selective.
2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a reasonable
inference from things the Bible /does/ say that those who are not in
Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an inference does not have the
authority of a direct statement.
BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality are also
condemned. The two are consistently paired.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
ObSF - Pournelle's "Inferno" which tries to account for Hell as a last resort treatment for its inmates - and therefore escapeable, even after a life of sin. I quite liked it, and there's a nice twist in the ending.

An interesting search term and book title is "Dare we hope "that all men be saved?""
Chrysi Cat
2020-01-10 23:04:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@sky.com
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things up, but
because they /never mention the other things condemned along with
homosexuality/. In particular, we /never/ hear how "liars will spend
an eternity in hell", although that is just as Biblical. It is their
/bias/ that shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that
causes them to be selective.
2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a reasonable
inference from things the Bible /does/ say that those who are not in
Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an inference does not have the
authority of a direct statement.
BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality are also
condemned. The two are consistently paired.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
ObSF - Pournelle's "Inferno" which tries to account for Hell as a last resort treatment for its inmates - and therefore escapeable, even after a life of sin. I quite liked it, and there's a nice twist in the ending.
An interesting search term and book title is "Dare we hope "that all men be saved?""
Not an idea unique to him (I assume this is Jerry and not JR) either.
While I'm sure it pre-dates David Hopkins's "Jack", I'm definitely _not_
equally-sure that Hopkins _read_ "Inferno".
--
Chrysi Cat
1/2 anthrocat, nearly 1/2 anthrofox, all magical
Transgoddess, quick to anger.
Call me Chrysi or call me Kat, I'll respond to either!
William Hyde
2020-01-11 00:41:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chrysi Cat
Post by m***@sky.com
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things up, but
because they /never mention the other things condemned along with
homosexuality/. In particular, we /never/ hear how "liars will spend
an eternity in hell", although that is just as Biblical. It is their
/bias/ that shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that
causes them to be selective.
2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a reasonable
inference from things the Bible /does/ say that those who are not in
Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an inference does not have the
authority of a direct statement.
BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality are also
condemned. The two are consistently paired.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
ObSF - Pournelle's "Inferno" which tries to account for Hell as a last resort treatment for its inmates - and therefore escapeable, even after a life of sin. I quite liked it, and there's a nice twist in the ending.
An interesting search term and book title is "Dare we hope "that all men be saved?""
Not an idea unique to him (I assume this is Jerry and not JR) either.
It goes at least as far back as the church father Origen, who died circa 250. It must have had some following as his works were not condemned for another three centuries.

The idea was revived in the Anglican church in the late 1800s with bishop Colenso holding it. A trial by the five senior Anglican bishops failed to condemn Colenso, who got off 3-2.

Leading to one of the more impenetrable and absurd comments I have ever read, by Gladstone or some other conservative Anglican, that the decision had "deprived Anglicans of their last hope of eternal damnation". And no, that was not a joke.

The quip that "hell was dismissed with costs" was the joke.


William Hyde
Peter Trei
2020-01-11 01:20:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Hyde
Post by Chrysi Cat
Post by m***@sky.com
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things up, but
because they /never mention the other things condemned along with
homosexuality/. In particular, we /never/ hear how "liars will spend
an eternity in hell", although that is just as Biblical. It is their
/bias/ that shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that
causes them to be selective.
2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a reasonable
inference from things the Bible /does/ say that those who are not in
Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an inference does not have the
authority of a direct statement.
BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality are also
condemned. The two are consistently paired.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
ObSF - Pournelle's "Inferno" which tries to account for Hell as a last resort treatment for its inmates - and therefore escapeable, even after a life of sin. I quite liked it, and there's a nice twist in the ending.
An interesting search term and book title is "Dare we hope "that all men be saved?""
Not an idea unique to him (I assume this is Jerry and not JR) either.
It goes at least as far back as the church father Origen, who died circa 250. It must have had some following as his works were not condemned for another three centuries.
The idea was revived in the Anglican church in the late 1800s with bishop Colenso holding it. A trial by the five senior Anglican bishops failed to condemn Colenso, who got off 3-2.
Leading to one of the more impenetrable and absurd comments I have ever read, by Gladstone or some other conservative Anglican, that the decision had "deprived Anglicans of their last hope of eternal damnation". And no, that was not a joke.
The quip that "hell was dismissed with costs" was the joke.
AKA 'Christian Universalism'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_universalism

pt
Titus G
2020-01-11 02:27:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Trei
Post by William Hyde
Post by Chrysi Cat
On Sunday, January 5, 2020 at 6:18:47 PM UTC, Paul S Person
On Sat, 4 Jan 2020 21:00:15 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
On Saturday, January 4, 2020 at 11:37:58 AM UTC-7, Paul S
On Sat, 4 Jan 2020 17:01:29 +1300, Titus G
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the
biblical threat to homosexuals of an eternity in hell.
Just a coincidence that global warming is affecting
weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes
extract from the Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of
backwards fundamentalists of all kinds, even those who
don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro Baptist
Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not
accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and
explicitly. It is not necessary for the fundamentalists to
make things up that they aren't finding there. It has a
bunch of other odd things in it as well.
1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things
up, but because they /never mention the other things
condemned along with homosexuality/. In particular, we
/never/ hear how "liars will spend an eternity in hell",
although that is just as Biblical. It is their /bias/ that
shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that causes
them to be selective.
2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
Post by Peter Trei
Post by William Hyde
Post by Chrysi Cat
an eternity in hell. It appears that my memory is correct for
once: the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a
reasonable inference from things the Bible /does/ say that
those who are not in Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an
inference does not have the authority of a direct statement.
BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality
are also condemned. The two are consistently paired. -- "I
begin to envy Petronius." "I have envied him long since."
ObSF - Pournelle's "Inferno" which tries to account for Hell as
a last resort treatment for its inmates - and therefore
escapeable, even after a life of sin. I quite liked it, and
there's a nice twist in the ending.
An interesting search term and book title is "Dare we hope
"that all men be saved?""
Not an idea unique to him (I assume this is Jerry and not JR) either.
It goes at least as far back as the church father Origen, who died
circa 250. It must have had some following as his works were not
condemned for another three centuries.
The idea was revived in the Anglican church in the late 1800s with
bishop Colenso holding it. A trial by the five senior Anglican
bishops failed to condemn Colenso, who got off 3-2.
Leading to one of the more impenetrable and absurd comments I have
ever read, by Gladstone or some other conservative Anglican, that
the decision had "deprived Anglicans of their last hope of eternal
damnation". And no, that was not a joke.
The quip that "hell was dismissed with costs" was the joke.
AKA 'Christian Universalism'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_universalism
pt
Yet yesterday I read advertising on a Christian church car warning of
eternal damnation on the rear and John 3:16 (everlasting life in heaven)
on the side.
It appears to me that what the congregation believes, what is preached,
and what the theologists agree upon, are many different things.
And if the state can't set its own citizens on fire for eternity, why
should a lesser institution have such power?
Paul S Person
2020-01-11 17:45:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Peter Trei
Post by William Hyde
Post by Chrysi Cat
Post by m***@sky.com
On Sat, 4 Jan 2020 21:00:15 -0800 (PST), Quadibloc
Post by Quadibloc
On Sat, 4 Jan 2020 17:01:29 +1300, Titus G
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the
biblical threat to homosexuals of an eternity in hell.
Just a coincidence that global warming is affecting
weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes
extract from the Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of
backwards fundamentalists of all kinds, even those who
don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro Baptist
Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not
accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and
explicitly. It is not necessary for the fundamentalists to
make things up that they aren't finding there. It has a
bunch of other odd things in it as well.
1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things
up, but because they /never mention the other things
condemned along with homosexuality/. In particular, we
/never/ hear how "liars will spend an eternity in hell",
although that is just as Biblical. It is their /bias/ that
shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that causes
them to be selective.
2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
Post by Peter Trei
Post by William Hyde
Post by Chrysi Cat
Post by m***@sky.com
an eternity in hell. It appears that my memory is correct for
once: the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a
reasonable inference from things the Bible /does/ say that
those who are not in Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an
inference does not have the authority of a direct statement.
BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality
are also condemned. The two are consistently paired. -- "I
begin to envy Petronius." "I have envied him long since."
ObSF - Pournelle's "Inferno" which tries to account for Hell as
a last resort treatment for its inmates - and therefore
escapeable, even after a life of sin. I quite liked it, and
there's a nice twist in the ending.
An interesting search term and book title is "Dare we hope
"that all men be saved?""
Not an idea unique to him (I assume this is Jerry and not JR) either.
It goes at least as far back as the church father Origen, who died
circa 250. It must have had some following as his works were not
condemned for another three centuries.
The idea was revived in the Anglican church in the late 1800s with
bishop Colenso holding it. A trial by the five senior Anglican
bishops failed to condemn Colenso, who got off 3-2.
Leading to one of the more impenetrable and absurd comments I have
ever read, by Gladstone or some other conservative Anglican, that
the decision had "deprived Anglicans of their last hope of eternal
damnation". And no, that was not a joke.
The quip that "hell was dismissed with costs" was the joke.
AKA 'Christian Universalism'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_universalism
pt
Yet yesterday I read advertising on a Christian church car warning of
eternal damnation on the rear and John 3:16 (everlasting life in heaven)
on the side.
It appears to me that what the congregation believes, what is preached,
and what the theologists agree upon, are many different things.
And if the state can't set its own citizens on fire for eternity, why
should a lesser institution have such power?
Law and Gospel.
Applicable (presumably) to everyone.
Very Protestant.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Quadibloc
2020-01-14 00:03:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Titus G
And if the state can't set its own citizens on fire for eternity, why
should a lesser institution have such power?
Churches aren't allowed to set people on fire.

God Himself, on the other hand, is _greater_ than any human government.

Churches... express their theories about what God wants of us.

John Savard
Peter Trei
2020-01-14 00:49:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
And if the state can't set its own citizens on fire for eternity, why
should a lesser institution have such power?
Churches aren't allowed to set people on fire.
God Himself, on the other hand, is _greater_ than any human government.
Churches... express their theories about what God wants of us.
Iirc, the RCC might pass a sentence of death, but the chore of actually setting people on fire
was turned over to the secular authorities.

Of course any God that claimed this sophistry exonerated the church from complicity, is a god
unworthy of worship.

Pt
Titus G
2020-01-14 05:16:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
And if the state can't set its own citizens on fire for eternity, why
should a lesser institution have such power?
Churches aren't allowed to set people on fire.
God Himself, on the other hand, is _greater_ than any human government.
Churches... express their theories about what God wants of us.
John Savard
Lazy writing by me. Let me try again.
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
And if the state can't set its own citizens on fire for eternity, why
should a lesser institution have the power to threaten to do so?
Thank you.

Titus G
2020-01-06 05:51:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things up, but
because they /never mention the other things condemned along with
homosexuality/. In particular, we /never/ hear how "liars will spend
an eternity in hell", although that is just as Biblical. It is their
/bias/ that shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that
causes them to be selective.
2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a reasonable
inference from things the Bible /does/ say that those who are not in
Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an inference does not have the
authority of a direct statement.
BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality are also
condemned. The two are consistently paired.
I am not arguing with you. Everyone interprets selected extracts from
the Bible to support their belief and even the craziest are sincere,
(the richest are those not to be trusted but that's another story). Five
million koalas were probably not all Sodomites but in the main, the
Pacific Island Community Churches still preach the 19th and 20thC
British versions of Christianity.
Paul S Person
2020-01-06 18:25:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Titus G
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
While one may quite rightly gave a negative opinion of backwards fundamentalists
of all kinds, even those who don't go to the extremes of the infamous Westboro
Baptist Church, I would feel that this statement of yours is not accurate.
The Bible does condemn homosexual acts, clearly and explicitly. It is not
necessary for the fundamentalists to make things up that they aren't finding
there. It has a bunch of other odd things in it as well.
1. They are /homophobic/, not because they are making things up, but
because they /never mention the other things condemned along with
homosexuality/. In particular, we /never/ hear how "liars will spend
an eternity in hell", although that is just as Biblical. It is their
/bias/ that shows them to be homophobic, and their homophobia that
causes them to be selective.
2. This page (one of many, I am sure)
https://www.openbible.info/topics/liars_shall_not_enter_the_kingdom_of_heaven
lists a fair number of references, most of which say /nothing/ about
the Bible does /not/ say this. It is, of course, a reasonable
inference from things the Bible /does/ say that those who are not in
Heaven will be in Hell; but that is an inference does not have the
authority of a direct statement.
BTW, so far as I can tell, every place that homosexuality is
explicitly condemned, at least some forms of heterosexuality are also
condemned. The two are consistently paired.
I am not arguing with you. Everyone interprets selected extracts from
the Bible to support their belief and even the craziest are sincere,
(the richest are those not to be trusted but that's another story). Five
million koalas were probably not all Sodomites but in the main, the
Pacific Island Community Churches still preach the 19th and 20thC
British versions of Christianity.
I would expect a British mission to have produce a Church of
England-related denomination. But perhaps it is, searching Google
brings up lots of Community Churches ... in the Seattle area.

But perhaps by "British" you mean "from Britain". Like the Pilgrims,
who were chased out of England by the CoE into Holland and then
colonized Massachusetts (more or less).

And homophobia, like sexism, has been a problem with alleged Biblical
support for a long, long time. It is, indeed, very traditional. The
problem is, /sola scriptura/, one of the slogans of Protestantism, is
/precisely/ about the non-authoritative nature of tradition.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
David DeLaney
2020-01-09 06:27:49 UTC
Permalink
Five million koalas were probably not all Sodomites but in the main, the
Pacific Island Community Churches still preach the 19th and 20thC
British versions of Christianity.
I will note, not speaking for either side here, that chlamydia DID run rampant
among them, infecting nearly every one. Have we checked recenty which
communicable diseases are still on God's naughty list?

Dave, can cite a webcomic on this
--
\/David DeLaney posting thru EarthLink - "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
my gatekeeper archives are no longer accessible :( / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Paul S Person
2020-01-09 23:57:25 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 09 Jan 2020 00:27:49 -0600, David DeLaney
Post by David DeLaney
Five million koalas were probably not all Sodomites but in the main, the
Pacific Island Community Churches still preach the 19th and 20thC
British versions of Christianity.
I will note, not speaking for either side here, that chlamydia DID run rampant
among them, infecting nearly every one. Have we checked recenty which
communicable diseases are still on God's naughty list?
Dave, can cite a webcomic on this
Leprosy -- or, rather, whatever was called "leprosy" back then. The
/current/ disease called "leprosy" is, as I understand it, something
else.

Anything producing any discharge.

And that's about it, IIRC.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Paul S Person
2020-01-05 18:02:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Titus G
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
No, I was not aware of that attitude being of the non-researched opinion
that Sodom and Gomorrah were the source of the christian missionary's
messages to Pacific Islanders et al.
That may well be, and would certainly be traditional, but who says the
inhabitants were ... Sodomites?

Who says they weren't just common, ordinary xenophobes?

(Which reminds me of the Flanders & Swann definition of "xenophobia".
First noting that "xenos" means both "stranger" and "guest",
"xenophobia" is then defined as "fear and loathing of guests".)

And I would /hope/ that one of the sources of the missionaries
messages was ... the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus of
Nazareth.

Indeed, I suspect that that /was/ their message, all else being
secondary.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Titus G
2020-01-06 05:26:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Titus G
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
The ARU fired their best rugby player who repeated the biblical threat
to homosexuals of an eternity in hell. Just a coincidence that global
warming is affecting weather elsewhere.
You mean, of course, "the threat that many homophobes extract from the
Bible by any means necessary".
No, I was not aware of that attitude being of the non-researched opinion
that Sodom and Gomorrah were the source of the christian missionary's
messages to Pacific Islanders et al.
That may well be, and would certainly be traditional, but who says the
inhabitants were ... Sodomites?
The British Empire. (Bible = King James Bible).
The English word, sodomy, is a good clue.
Post by Paul S Person
Who says they weren't just common, ordinary xenophobes?
(Which reminds me of the Flanders & Swann definition of "xenophobia".
First noting that "xenos" means both "stranger" and "guest",
"xenophobia" is then defined as "fear and loathing of guests".)
And I would /hope/ that one of the sources of the missionaries
messages was ... the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus of
Nazareth.
Indeed, I suspect that that /was/ their message, all else being
secondary.
Ha, ha, ha. The missionaries usually arrive after the red shirts whose
objectives are profit from exploitation through skullduggery and
control. The Bible is still used in courts of law in Aotearoa and other
Pacific Islands to terrorise natives because if you give false witness
swearing on the Bible you choose eternity in hell.
Or are those Bibles in court primarily to message "the life, death, and
resurrection of Jesus of Nazareth."?
Peter Trei
2020-01-04 17:44:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
The Sheep Look Up by Brunner gets there.

pt
William Hyde
2020-01-04 22:13:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Enough of this unseemly panic-mongering!

Why, the fires in New South Wales are barely double the area of fire in the entire US in the year 2019. OK, a little over. But not nearly triple! And I'm sure the rest of Australia is just fine.

Plus, think of the employment opportunities it is giving to Canadian fire fighters in the off season! It's like Christmas all over again!


William Hyde
Lynn McGuire
2020-01-05 04:56:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
"Australia Fires … And Misfires"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/

"It has been hotter, fires have burnt larger areas"

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/it-has-been-hotter-fires-have-burnt-larger-areas/

Lynn
h***@gmail.com
2020-01-05 10:39:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
"Australia Fires … And Misfires"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/
Here the author, who lives in California so has no direct knowledge of anything in Australia, claims that rainfall has been higher in Australia recently.
What he's ignoring is that Australia is almost 80% the size of the the USA
Rainfall has been higher in the North but lower in the South and Eastern seaboard.
The article has a graph of rainfall in NSW and it has rainfall above the average rainfall in 4 years since 2000
The last year shown in the graph is the lowest rainfall ever recorded in NSW.
But rather than look at that he's arbitrarily decided to consider the last 50 years and say that's wetter than the first 50 years of the 20th century (I don't know how directly comparable the readings are, how did the coverage compare, does the equipment used in both eras deal with evaporation the same way etc)

Even apart from that not all rainfall is equal for all purposes, a quick check suggests that there's been more regular floods in NSW since 2000 than before because of more high intensity rainfalls. Which isn't as useful for vegetation or bushfire mitigation as more regular, lower intensity rainfall.

I address the point about fire reduction burns later.
Post by Lynn McGuire
"It has been hotter, fires have burnt larger areas"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/it-has-been-hotter-fires-have-burnt-larger-areas/
So his evidence that it's been hotter in the past is measurements from 1 year at one weather station from 38-39.
He doesn't provide any data from that station over the last 22 years so he provides no evidence that 38-39 was hotter than now even in that 1 location.

http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/current/season/vic/archive/201902.summary.shtml
has 2018-19 as the hottest average temperature across victoria since decent records were taken (back around 1910, before that the temperature readings weren't standardised)
33 weather stations had their highest temperature reading ever although many of them don't have a long history
http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/current/season/vic/archive/201902.summary.shtml#recordsAvgHigh

AS for his claims about bushfires
- fuel reduction burns have happened, there have been problems with them because hot and dry conditions mean that often it's not safe to perform them.
- in bad enough conditions fuel reduction burns don't have much impact on fires. One of the towns that was badly hit by a fire in December had the fire come through an area that had been burned off 3 months earlier. One of the towns in Victoria that was hit in the last week had a fire approach through an area that a previous bushfire had already gone through this summer.

As for fatalities, my brother in law is a member of the VFS locally, based on discussions with him there have been a lot of changes in approach since 2009 to reduce fatalities
In the black saturday fires 113 people died inside homes, now people are evacuated.
Despite that we're now up to 25 deaths (plus people missing, the last I heard that was up around 20 but some of them may have been found and some of them might be part of why the deaths is higher than it was yesterday)
The Author claims that during the Black Friday fires in 1939 2 million hectares were burnt, currently we're at about 6.3 million hectares this bushfire season, and it's still got months to go.

We also have modern fire fighting techniques, transportation and technology so we should be a lot better at fighting fires than we were in the 30s

In short there's bullshit claims that we haven't been doing hazard reduction burns
There's extremely dubious analysis of historical temperature and rainfall.

They completely ignore that some of the current bushfires started in September, that's early Spring. The traditional bushfire season is December to March/April.
We've had bushfires going for 3 months and probably will for another 3-4 months...
William Hyde
2020-01-05 21:04:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
"Australia Fires … And Misfires"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/
"It has been hotter, fires have burnt larger areas"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/it-has-been-hotter-fires-have-burnt-larger-areas/
You had me worried with that reasonable quote from this site on ice ages.

But they're back in form now, it seems.

William Hyde
Lynn McGuire
2020-01-06 18:35:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Hyde
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
"Australia Fires … And Misfires"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/
"It has been hotter, fires have burnt larger areas"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/it-has-been-hotter-fires-have-burnt-larger-areas/
You had me worried with that reasonable quote from this site on ice ages.
But they're back in form now, it seems.
William Hyde
You are welcome. I wonder if Australia will go back to clearing out the
underbrush. In fact, I wonder if California will go back to clearing
out the underbrush. From
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/

"And when you add the incredibly high fuel load in the oily flammable
eucalyptus forest to the fact that more than a dozen arsonists have been
arrested for starting many of the fires, it should come as no surprise
to anyone that these fires have been devastating, destructive, fatal,
and horrible …"

"It should come as no surprise because they were warned. Clearly.
Repeatedly."

"Now, I live in the fire zone in California, and so I have great
sympathy and compassion for those who are in the path of the fires in
Australia. And our fire problem here is inter alia for the same
reason—abysmal forest management practices driven by Green activists
with hearts of gold and brains of oatmeal."

Lynn
Alan Baker
2020-01-06 18:41:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by William Hyde
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
"Australia Fires … And Misfires"
     https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/
"It has been hotter, fires have burnt larger areas"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/it-has-been-hotter-fires-have-burnt-larger-areas/
You had me worried with that reasonable quote from this site on ice ages.
But they're back in form now, it seems.
William Hyde
You are welcome.  I wonder if Australia will go back to clearing out the
underbrush.  In fact, I wonder if California will go back to clearing
out the underbrush.  From
   https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/
"And when you add the incredibly high fuel load in the oily flammable
eucalyptus forest to the fact that more than a dozen arsonists have been
arrested for starting many of the fires, it should come as no surprise
to anyone that these fires have been devastating, destructive, fatal,
and horrible …"
"It should come as no surprise because they were warned. Clearly.
Repeatedly."
"Now, I live in the fire zone in California, and so I have great
sympathy and compassion for those who are in the path of the fires in
Australia. And our fire problem here is inter alia for the same
reason—abysmal forest management practices driven by Green activists
with hearts of gold and brains of oatmeal."
Lynn
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!
Scott Lurndal
2020-01-06 19:34:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by William Hyde
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
"Australia Fires 
 And Misfires"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/
"It has been hotter, fires have burnt larger areas"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/it-has-been-hotter-fires-have-burnt-larger-areas/
You had me worried with that reasonable quote from this site on ice ages.
But they're back in form now, it seems.
William Hyde
You are welcome. I wonder if Australia will go back to clearing out the
underbrush. In fact, I wonder if California will go back to clearing
out the underbrush.
You really gotta stop listening to the clown in the white house. Clearing
underbrush won't make any difference.

Clear space around structures (something California has required for
decades) is much more efficacious. Repairing decades of neglect of
the electrical transmission system will also be much more efficacious.
h***@gmail.com
2020-01-07 05:15:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by William Hyde
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
"Australia Fires … And Misfires"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/
"It has been hotter, fires have burnt larger areas"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/it-has-been-hotter-fires-have-burnt-larger-areas/
You had me worried with that reasonable quote from this site on ice ages.
But they're back in form now, it seems.
William Hyde
You are welcome. I wonder if Australia will go back to clearing out the
underbrush. In fact, I wonder if California will go back to clearing
out the underbrush.
You really gotta stop listening to the clown in the white house. Clearing
underbrush won't make any difference.
That's not exactly true,
reducing fuel load does have an impact on fire intensity in some conditions.
But when heat, wind, humidity etc are working in favor of the fire it has virtually no impact on the fire intensities.

With climate change we're getting those adverse conditions more often.
Stephen Harker
2020-01-07 07:20:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by William Hyde
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
"Australia Fires … And Misfires"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/australia-fires-and-misses/
"It has been hotter, fires have burnt larger areas"
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/01/04/it-has-been-hotter-fires-have-burnt-larger-areas/
You had me worried with that reasonable quote from this site on ice ages.
But they're back in form now, it seems.
William Hyde
You are welcome. I wonder if Australia will go back to clearing out the
underbrush. In fact, I wonder if California will go back to clearing
out the underbrush.
You really gotta stop listening to the clown in the white house. Clearing
underbrush won't make any difference.
That's not exactly true,
reducing fuel load does have an impact on fire intensity in some conditions.
But when heat, wind, humidity etc are working in favor of the fire it has virtually no impact on the fire intensities.
With climate change we're getting those adverse conditions more often.
Hazard reduction burns needs to be undertaken when of value. Old style
burns are of limited value and, as you say, not always possible. So a
smarter approach is needed based around analysis of fires and what works
and does not work. These articles at least partly refer to studies and
analysis of past fires.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-20/hazard-reduction-burns-bushfires/11817336
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-07/fuel-reduction-burn-debate-rubbish-says-vic-fire-chief/11849522
--
Stephen Harker ***@netspace.net.au
was: http://sjharker.customer.netspace.net.au/
now: http://members.iinet.net.au/~***@netspace.net.au/
or: http://members.iinet.net.au/~sjharker_nbn/
nuny@bid.nes
2020-01-08 23:56:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Last I saw the burned area is slightly smaller than the US state of Maryland.

Oh, and the Sydney police are investigating the bushfires as arson. One wonders what they know that isn't being published in the MSM.
Post by David DeLaney
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
Didn't you read "Worlds of the Imperium"? They're all bad.


Mark L. Fergerson
Lynn McGuire
2020-01-09 00:27:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@bid.nes
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Last I saw the burned area is slightly smaller than the US state of Maryland.
Oh, and the Sydney police are investigating the bushfires as arson. One wonders what they know that isn't being published in the MSM.
Post by David DeLaney
Dave, more evidence that the LHC managed to drop us into the Bad Timeline
Didn't you read "Worlds of the Imperium"? They're all bad.
Mark L. Fergerson
Some universes are worse than others, Universe #1 is all black and white:
https://www.gocomics.com/alley-oop/2019/12/12

The only food source in Universe #68 is crystals and they smell like wet
dog:
https://www.gocomics.com/alley-oop/2019/11/26

Lynn
h***@gmail.com
2020-01-09 04:39:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@bid.nes
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Last I saw the burned area is slightly smaller than the US state of Maryland.
Maryland 12,407 sq mi
current estimates of the 2019-20 fire season 41,000 square miles
Post by ***@bid.nes
Oh, and the Sydney police are investigating the bushfires as arson. One wonders what they know that isn't being published in the MSM.
Be a bit careful about believing that
a) The Murdoch media and a few other media companies are run by people who are quite willing to lie to push their "no such thing as climate change, coal is beautiful" agenda.
There's been stories saying 200 arsonists have been prosecuted, that'd be the total number for the year, not to do with the bushfires.
There's a story about 183 people prosecuted in NSW since the start of the bushfire season.
According to NSW police that's 24 for Arson, fines for 47 for not observing a fire ban, 53 for discarding lit cigarettes or matches (or the last 2 might be the other way around) which is a much different situation than the article is pushing.

b) There's investigations on most bushfires

c) The estimate is that about 40% of all bushfires are deliberately lit, the issue is not so much how they've started but why they've spread and burned so much. That's due to environmental conditions.

The fire service has also stated that at least most of the big fires haven't been deliberately lit.
William Hyde
2020-01-09 19:40:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by ***@bid.nes
Post by David DeLaney
So... I've been thinking, and I don't recall any forecasting in the literature
that as the year 2020 began, one of the continents would be ENGULFED IN FLAMES.
Last I saw the burned area is slightly smaller than the US state of Maryland.
As of Jan 7, the area burned is estimated at over 32,000 square miles. Almost three times the size of Maryland. Should be the size of Indiana soon.

A cool week with some rain has not solved the problem in NSW, though it has helped.

William Hyde
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