Discussion:
National Space Society?
(too old to reply)
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2020-01-13 04:36:57 UTC
Permalink
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.

It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...

Seems more Heinleinian too.

Thoughts?
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Moriarty
2020-01-13 04:51:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"

-Moriarty
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2020-01-13 04:56:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Moriarty
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"
-Moriarty
With a fountain pen.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2020-01-13 20:08:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Moriarty
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"
-Moriarty
With a fountain pen.
The kind you have to refill from an ink bottle?
Or the kind that uses cartridges?
It's a Schaeffer that uses the "Skrip" cartridges. You can also
get a pump that has the same form factor as a cartridge if you want
to use an ink bottle, but those tend to leak a bit more. The older
cartridges that are flat on both ends are the best, the newer ones
cheat you out of a little ink for now good reason.

There's nothing that writes like a fountain pen, but beware bad
paper: I once had to take a college exam that required me to buy
a special blank test booklet. It turned out those cheap pages were
about as good for writing as a paper towel and I turned in an almost
illegible mess to that prof...
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
m***@sky.com
2020-01-13 20:32:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Moriarty
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"
-Moriarty
With a fountain pen.
The kind you have to refill from an ink bottle?
Or the kind that uses cartridges?
It's a Schaeffer that uses the "Skrip" cartridges. You can also
get a pump that has the same form factor as a cartridge if you want
to use an ink bottle, but those tend to leak a bit more. The older
cartridges that are flat on both ends are the best, the newer ones
cheat you out of a little ink for now good reason.
There's nothing that writes like a fountain pen, but beware bad
paper: I once had to take a college exam that required me to buy
a special blank test booklet. It turned out those cheap pages were
about as good for writing as a paper towel and I turned in an almost
illegible mess to that prof...
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
I have a couple of fountain pens lying around, and even a bottle of ink somewhere, but since I crave a reliable legible line rather than picturesque italic, I find modern disposables such as the Pilot V5 actually preferable. The old Pentel isn't that bad either. I once went on Amazon (and waited) to order some Pigma Micron pens, because I saw Randall Munroe using one on YouTube. Very nice, but not that much ahead of the Pilot V5 (which you can get in supermarkets here) that I have reordered. FWIW I once used a Fisher Space Pen in harsh circumstances (on an outdoor team-building exercise in the middle of a partially flooded slate mine - horrid). I found that the limiting factor here was the disintegration of the paper I was writing on.
D B Davis
2020-01-13 22:07:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@sky.com
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Moriarty
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"
-Moriarty
With a fountain pen.
The kind you have to refill from an ink bottle?
Or the kind that uses cartridges?
It's a Schaeffer that uses the "Skrip" cartridges. You can also
get a pump that has the same form factor as a cartridge if you want
to use an ink bottle, but those tend to leak a bit more. The older
cartridges that are flat on both ends are the best, the newer ones
cheat you out of a little ink for now good reason.
There's nothing that writes like a fountain pen, but beware bad
paper: I once had to take a college exam that required me to buy
a special blank test booklet. It turned out those cheap pages were
about as good for writing as a paper towel and I turned in an almost
illegible mess to that prof...
I have a couple of fountain pens lying around, and even a bottle of ink
somewhere, but since I crave a reliable legible line rather than picturesque
italic, I find modern disposables such as the Pilot V5 actually preferable.
The old Pentel isn't that bad either. I once went on Amazon (and waited) to
order some Pigma Micron pens, because I saw Randall Munroe using one on
YouTube. Very nice, but not that much ahead of the Pilot V5 (which you can
get in supermarkets here) that I have reordered. FWIW I once used a Fisher
Space Pen in harsh circumstances (on an outdoor team-building exercise in
the middle of a partially flooded slate mine - horrid). I found that the
limiting factor here was the disintegration of the paper I was writing on.
A Pilot G-2's my own weapon of choice that's mightier than the sword (in
case you weren't interested.)



Thank you,
--
Don.......My cat's )\._.,--....,'``.
telltale tall tail /, _.. \ _\ (`._ ,.
tells tall tales.. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
J. Clarke
2020-01-14 00:41:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@sky.com
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Moriarty
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"
-Moriarty
With a fountain pen.
The kind you have to refill from an ink bottle?
Or the kind that uses cartridges?
It's a Schaeffer that uses the "Skrip" cartridges. You can also
get a pump that has the same form factor as a cartridge if you want
to use an ink bottle, but those tend to leak a bit more. The older
cartridges that are flat on both ends are the best, the newer ones
cheat you out of a little ink for now good reason.
There's nothing that writes like a fountain pen, but beware bad
paper: I once had to take a college exam that required me to buy
a special blank test booklet. It turned out those cheap pages were
about as good for writing as a paper towel and I turned in an almost
illegible mess to that prof...
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
I have a couple of fountain pens lying around, and even a bottle of ink somewhere, but since I crave a reliable legible line rather than picturesque italic, I find modern disposables such as the Pilot V5 actually preferable. The old Pentel isn't that bad either. I once went on Amazon (and waited) to order some Pigma Micron pens, because I saw Randall Munroe using one on YouTube. Very nice, but not that much ahead of the Pilot V5 (which you can get in supermarkets here) that I have reordered. FWIW I once used a Fisher Space Pen in harsh circumstances (on an outdoor team-building exercise in the middle of a partially flooded slate mine - horrid). I found that the limiting factor here was the disintegration of the paper I was writing on.
I have some V5s--don't really like them--when they write they make a
nice line but they don't start reliably and don't stay started. The
G2s have been in general more satisfactory.

However I do have a customized Lamy and Herbin ink--that is quite
nice.
Paul S Person
2020-01-14 18:01:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Moriarty
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"
-Moriarty
With a fountain pen.
The kind you have to refill from an ink bottle?
Or the kind that uses cartridges?
It's a Schaeffer that uses the "Skrip" cartridges. You can also
get a pump that has the same form factor as a cartridge if you want
to use an ink bottle, but those tend to leak a bit more. The older
cartridges that are flat on both ends are the best, the newer ones
cheat you out of a little ink for now good reason.
Leaks: that's what pocket protectors are for!

As to the new cartridges: giving the customer less for more is the
American Way of business!
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
There's nothing that writes like a fountain pen, but beware bad
paper: I once had to take a college exam that required me to buy
a special blank test booklet. It turned out those cheap pages were
about as good for writing as a paper towel and I turned in an almost
illegible mess to that prof...
Were it's covers blue, by any chance?

Did the pages actually have wood chips embedded in them?

Quality writing instruments /demand/ quality paper.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Ted Nolan <tednolan>
2020-01-14 18:16:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
On Monday, January 13, 2020 at 3:37:00 PM UTC+11, Ted Nolan
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"
-Moriarty
With a fountain pen.
The kind you have to refill from an ink bottle?
Or the kind that uses cartridges?
It's a Schaeffer that uses the "Skrip" cartridges. You can also
get a pump that has the same form factor as a cartridge if you want
to use an ink bottle, but those tend to leak a bit more. The older
cartridges that are flat on both ends are the best, the newer ones
cheat you out of a little ink for now good reason.
Leaks: that's what pocket protectors are for!
As to the new cartridges: giving the customer less for more is the
American Way of business!
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
There's nothing that writes like a fountain pen, but beware bad
paper: I once had to take a college exam that required me to buy
a special blank test booklet. It turned out those cheap pages were
about as good for writing as a paper towel and I turned in an almost
illegible mess to that prof...
Were it's covers blue, by any chance?
Ah, yep!
Post by Paul S Person
Did the pages actually have wood chips embedded in them?
And, yep again.
Post by Paul S Person
Quality writing instruments /demand/ quality paper.
Hard lesson! (Actually I did OK, though I'm sure the prof or TA could
have been happier trying to parse my blots)
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Robert Carnegie
2020-01-14 22:45:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
Post by Moriarty
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
My first thought was: "you still write checks?"
-Moriarty
With a fountain pen.
--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..
Surely members are permitted to use a "Space Pen"
for this. While lying on one's back, perhaps.

Lynn McGuire
2020-01-13 06:51:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
SpaceX is privately owned by Elon Musk and his partners. The ante is a
couple of billion dollars.

Lynn
J. Clarke
2020-01-13 07:00:11 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 00:51:29 -0600, Lynn McGuire
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
SpaceX is privately owned by Elon Musk and his partners. The ante is a
couple of billion dollars.
Actually is know that several blocks of SpaceX traded in the 20-30
million range.

Currently the share value is estimated to be around $25000.

But as you say it is privately held--you have to know someone to have
a chance of getting involved.
Torbjorn Lindgren
2020-01-13 15:28:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 00:51:29 -0600, Lynn McGuire
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
SpaceX is privately owned by Elon Musk and his partners. The ante is a
couple of billion dollars.
Actually is know that several blocks of SpaceX traded in the 20-30
million range.
Currently the share value is estimated to be around $25000.
You got way too many zeros there, the last investor fundraising (April
2019) valued individual shares at $204 for a total valuation of $33.3
billion[1].

There's no official valuations after that since it's not publicly
traded but it sounds plausible that some analysts might assign it a
value of $250/share ($40.8 billion total valuation), IE two zeros
less.
Post by J. Clarke
But as you say it is privately held--you have to know someone to have
a chance of getting involved.
IIRC there's even restrictions on who can buy them? I have feeling
someone mentioned there some restrictions on unlisted stock purchases
in the US (something about minumum income and/or minimum wealth).

I guess you could try support them indirectly by buying shares of a
publicly traded company that owns SpaceX shares.

One obvious candidate is Alphabet (IE Google) since they apparently
own 7.5% of the SpaceX shares[2],. However based on relative
valuations (Alphabet is *BIG*) that only adds up to ~0.3-0.5% of the
Alphabet share value coming from SpaceX shares they own so very
indirect.

I'm not going to go through the list to see if there's a smaller
entity that might result in a higher percentage "indirect ownership".

1. https://www.cnbc.com/2019/05/31/spacex-valuation-33point3-billion-after-starlink-satellites-fundraising.html
2. https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/08/19/how-to-invest-in-spacex-stock-theres-just-1-way.aspx
Peter Trei
2020-01-14 00:41:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Torbjorn Lindgren
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 00:51:29 -0600, Lynn McGuire
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
SpaceX is privately owned by Elon Musk and his partners. The ante is a
couple of billion dollars.
Actually is know that several blocks of SpaceX traded in the 20-30
million range.
Currently the share value is estimated to be around $25000.
You got way too many zeros there, the last investor fundraising (April
2019) valued individual shares at $204 for a total valuation of $33.3
billion[1].
There's no official valuations after that since it's not publicly
traded but it sounds plausible that some analysts might assign it a
value of $250/share ($40.8 billion total valuation), IE two zeros
less.
Post by J. Clarke
But as you say it is privately held--you have to know someone to have
a chance of getting involved.
IIRC there's even restrictions on who can buy them? I have feeling
someone mentioned there some restrictions on unlisted stock purchases
in the US (something about minumum income and/or minimu
You have to be an 'accredited investor'

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accredited_investor#United_States

Since my wife semi-retired, I no longer qualify.

Pt
J. Clarke
2020-01-14 00:43:06 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 15:28:52 -0000 (UTC), Torbjorn Lindgren
Post by Torbjorn Lindgren
Post by J. Clarke
On Mon, 13 Jan 2020 00:51:29 -0600, Lynn McGuire
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Seems more Heinleinian too.
Thoughts?
SpaceX is privately owned by Elon Musk and his partners. The ante is a
couple of billion dollars.
Actually is know that several blocks of SpaceX traded in the 20-30
million range.
Currently the share value is estimated to be around $25000.
You got way too many zeros there, the last investor fundraising (April
2019) valued individual shares at $204 for a total valuation of $33.3
billion[1].
That was an investor fundraising offering new shares. The shares that
one paid $27 for when it started out are worth a great deal more.
Post by Torbjorn Lindgren
There's no official valuations after that since it's not publicly
traded but it sounds plausible that some analysts might assign it a
value of $250/share ($40.8 billion total valuation), IE two zeros
less.
Post by J. Clarke
But as you say it is privately held--you have to know someone to have
a chance of getting involved.
IIRC there's even restrictions on who can buy them? I have feeling
someone mentioned there some restrictions on unlisted stock purchases
in the US (something about minumum income and/or minimum wealth).
I guess you could try support them indirectly by buying shares of a
publicly traded company that owns SpaceX shares.
One obvious candidate is Alphabet (IE Google) since they apparently
own 7.5% of the SpaceX shares[2],. However based on relative
valuations (Alphabet is *BIG*) that only adds up to ~0.3-0.5% of the
Alphabet share value coming from SpaceX shares they own so very
indirect.
I'm not going to go through the list to see if there's a smaller
entity that might result in a higher percentage "indirect ownership".
1. https://www.cnbc.com/2019/05/31/spacex-valuation-33point3-billion-after-starlink-satellites-fundraising.html
2. https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/08/19/how-to-invest-in-spacex-stock-theres-just-1-way.aspx
Jack Bohn
2020-01-13 16:07:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
It's not much of an expense really, but as I signed the check, I
started to wonder if I've been a sucker all these years. It seems
to me I could have done more for the cause by buying SpaceX or
Virgin Galactic shares rather than supporting an organization that
seems to mainly lobby the feds...
Do you get a newsletter?

IIRC, lobbying the Feds is not just for them to do more launches, but improving conditions for encouraging private company launches.
--
-Jack
Mike Van Pelt
2020-01-13 18:16:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ted Nolan <tednolan>
I was paying bills this evening, and wrote out my annual dues for
the National Space Society. I've been a passive member (page through
the newsletter and think "Go, Space!") since it was the L5 Society.
Hm... I was a member of the L5 Society way back when, kind of
drifted away when it merged with the "We don't need no astronauts,
just send robots" National Space Institute. I've heard their
name come up from time to time, but haven't paid much attention.

SpaceX, Blue Origin, etc., are a lot more interesting to me
now, but as others have said, there's not much opportunity to
get personally involved. (Other than going to work for Musk
or Bezos, I suppose.)
--
Mike Van Pelt | "I don't advise it unless you're nuts."
mvp at calweb.com | -- Ray Wilkinson, after riding out Hurricane
KE6BVH | Ike on Surfside Beach in Galveston
s***@yahoo.com
2020-01-13 21:09:55 UTC
Permalink
I'm glad to be reminded they exist. I was liking the L-5, and sorry it went away.

Nils K. Hammer
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