Discussion:
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
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Lynn McGuire
2020-03-16 18:59:02 UTC
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Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16

Nooooooooooo !!!!!!

Lynn
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-16 20:40:54 UTC
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Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.

I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.

It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-16 22:15:11 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.

It's like living in a banana republic.
Robert Carnegie
2020-03-16 23:20:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
I think I saw an article on the BBC news web site
saying "Can President Trump make you not go to work",
with answer "no", but I can't find it so maybe
he can...

But the federal government gets shut down all the time
nowadays. I'm not sure it isn't shut down now.
Robert Carnegie
2020-03-17 00:17:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
I think I saw an article on the BBC news web site
saying "Can President Trump make you not go to work",
with answer "no", but I can't find it so maybe
he can...
...oops.
<https://www.snopes.com/news/2020/03/10/if-you-get-sick-with-coronavirus-can-donald-trump-make-you-stay-home/>

But actually from "The Conversation".

If it's that Federal government that we're discussing,
the argument is that /it/ doesn't have that kind of
power, but government closer to you does.
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-17 01:20:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
I think I saw an article on the BBC news web site
saying "Can President Trump make you not go to work",
with answer "no", but I can't find it so maybe
he can...
...oops.
<https://www.snopes.com/news/2020/03/10/if-you-get-sick-with-coronavirus-can-donald-trump-make-you-stay-home/>
But actually from "The Conversation".
If it's that Federal government that we're discussing,
the argument is that /it/ doesn't have that kind of
power, but government closer to you does.
Yes. Around here it's mayors, county Dept. of Health officials,
and Governor Newsom who are strongly suggesting that people stay home.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-17 01:36:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
I think I saw an article on the BBC news web site
saying "Can President Trump make you not go to work",
with answer "no", but I can't find it so maybe
he can...
...oops.
<https://www.snopes.com/news/2020/03/10/if-you-get-sick-with-coronavirus-can-donald-trump-make-you-stay-home/>
But actually from "The Conversation".
If it's that Federal government that we're discussing,
the argument is that /it/ doesn't have that kind of
power, but government closer to you does.
Yes. Around here it's mayors, county Dept. of Health officials,
and Governor Newsom who are strongly suggesting that people stay home.
"Strongly suggesting" is fine. Around here they have closed every bar
and and restaurant, I saw the last movie tonight that will be shown in
a theater in New England for the foreseeable future.

There is no excuse for this kind of panic. It's not the disease that
people are afraid of, it's what the government is going to do. We
need to trim our government to about a tenth of its current size and
pull most of its teeth.
Ross Presser
2020-03-17 13:29:45 UTC
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Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
There is no excuse for this kind of panic. It's not the disease that
people are afraid of, it's what the government is going to do. We
need to trim our government to about a tenth of its current size and
pull most of its teeth.
Sure, because this pandemic would go SO much better if there were no
government agencies trying to handle this public health disaster.
Magewolf
2020-03-17 17:28:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Ross Presser
Post by J. Clarke
There is no excuse for this kind of panic. It's not the disease that
people are afraid of, it's what the government is going to do. We
need to trim our government to about a tenth of its current size and
pull most of its teeth.
Sure, because this pandemic would go SO much better if there were no
government agencies trying to handle this public health disaster.
You have to understand,if this country was run under the correct
Libertarian values this disease would be no problem. Since spreading
potentially lethal germs would be an attack on a persons life and
property everyone would have the right to pull out their desert eagle
and shoot anyone coughing in their presence.
J. Clarke
2020-03-17 21:33:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 06:29:45 -0700 (PDT), Ross Presser
Post by Ross Presser
Post by J. Clarke
There is no excuse for this kind of panic. It's not the disease that
people are afraid of, it's what the government is going to do. We
need to trim our government to about a tenth of its current size and
pull most of its teeth.
Sure, because this pandemic would go SO much better if there were no
government agencies trying to handle this public health disaster.
So far the only thing "government agencies" have done is close
businesses and tell us to stay home.

CDC is like NASA, a tiny fraction of the government budget.

The governor of Ohio just ignored a court order because to him
elections aren't actually important. He needs to go to jail.
Paul S Person
2020-03-17 17:58:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:36:22 -0400, J. Clarke
<snippo, Fed gummint /can't/ do lockdown>
<I guess some people never heard of martial law>
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Yes. Around here it's mayors, county Dept. of Health officials,
and Governor Newsom who are strongly suggesting that people stay home.
"Strongly suggesting" is fine. Around here they have closed every bar
and and restaurant, I saw the last movie tonight that will be shown in
a theater in New England for the foreseeable future.
Restaurants etc here can continue ... so long as they only do
take-out, whether picked up or delivered.

Can an entire industry shift from personal service to take-out? We
shall see.
Post by J. Clarke
There is no excuse for this kind of panic. It's not the disease that
people are afraid of, it's what the government is going to do. We
need to trim our government to about a tenth of its current size and
pull most of its teeth.
You go first.

That way, the rest of the country can see what happens.

But don't expect us to follow you if it turns out you went over a
cliff.

Might help you recover, though, at the price of putting the government
back into operation.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
J. Clarke
2020-03-17 21:34:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 10:58:48 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:36:22 -0400, J. Clarke
<snippo, Fed gummint /can't/ do lockdown>
<I guess some people never heard of martial law>
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Yes. Around here it's mayors, county Dept. of Health officials,
and Governor Newsom who are strongly suggesting that people stay home.
"Strongly suggesting" is fine. Around here they have closed every bar
and and restaurant, I saw the last movie tonight that will be shown in
a theater in New England for the foreseeable future.
Restaurants etc here can continue ... so long as they only do
take-out, whether picked up or delivered.
Can an entire industry shift from personal service to take-out? We
shall see.
Post by J. Clarke
There is no excuse for this kind of panic. It's not the disease that
people are afraid of, it's what the government is going to do. We
need to trim our government to about a tenth of its current size and
pull most of its teeth.
You go first.
I go first and do what? I don't have the power to reduce the size of
government.
Post by Paul S Person
That way, the rest of the country can see what happens.
But don't expect us to follow you if it turns out you went over a
cliff.
Might help you recover, though, at the price of putting the government
back into operation.
Ross Presser
2020-03-18 16:53:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 10:58:48 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:36:22 -0400, J. Clarke
[snip]
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Paul S Person
Post by J. Clarke
There is no excuse for this kind of panic. It's not the disease that
people are afraid of, it's what the government is going to do. We
need to trim our government to about a tenth of its current size and
pull most of its teeth.
You go first.
I go first and do what? I don't have the power to reduce the size of
government.
Reduce *yourself* to a tenth of your current size and pull most of
*your* teeth.
Jay E. Morris
2020-03-17 02:44:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Robert Carnegie
But actually from "The Conversation".
If it's that Federal government that we're discussing,
the argument is that/it/ doesn't have that kind of
power, but government closer to you does.
Yes. Around here it's mayors, county Dept. of Health officials,
and Governor Newsom who are strongly suggesting that people stay home.
San Francisco bay area counties have ordered a shelter in place for
nearly 7 million people. I forget if that's your area.

https://www.politico.com/states/california/story/2020/03/16/sf-bay-area-counties-to-require-nearly-7m-residents-to-stay-home-9421959
--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
Dimensional Traveler
2020-03-17 02:54:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Jay E. Morris
Post by Robert Carnegie
But actually from "The Conversation".
If it's that Federal government that we're discussing,
the argument is that/it/  doesn't have that kind of
power, but government closer to you does.
Yes.  Around here it's mayors, county Dept. of Health officials,
and Governor Newsom who are strongly suggesting that people stay home.
San Francisco bay area counties have ordered a shelter in place for
nearly 7 million people. I forget if that's your area.
https://www.politico.com/states/california/story/2020/03/16/sf-bay-area-counties-to-require-nearly-7m-residents-to-stay-home-9421959
It is.
--
"You need to believe in things that aren't true. How else can they become?"
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-17 03:49:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Jay E. Morris
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Robert Carnegie
But actually from "The Conversation".
If it's that Federal government that we're discussing,
the argument is that/it/ doesn't have that kind of
power, but government closer to you does.
Yes. Around here it's mayors, county Dept. of Health officials,
and Governor Newsom who are strongly suggesting that people stay home.
San Francisco bay area counties have ordered a shelter in place for
nearly 7 million people. I forget if that's your area.
I'm in Vallejo, northeast of San Francisco, in Solano County,
which has not yet issued any orders about sheltering.* OTOH it is
highly recommended, statewide, that people over 65 self-isolate;
Hal's 70 and I'm 77. So we're doing that. The order does make
exceptions for groceries and pharmacies and several other essential
services ... including legal services, which means my daughter
gets to continue working for her boss the lawyer. My son-in-law
is working from home.
Post by Jay E. Morris
https://www.politico.com/states/california/story/2020/03/16/sf-bay-area-counties-to-require-nearly-7m-residents-to-stay-home-9421959
"Vital businesses like grocery stores, banks and pharmacies will
remain open, San Francisco Mayor London Breed said, and
indispensable government services will continue." And it turns
out, legal services are also exempted ... but all the courthouses
in the region are closing, so Meg does not have to drive around
from Martinez to Redwood City to deliver documents to them.
____
*In spite of, if I remember correctly, Solano County having had
the first two COVID-19 cases in California. (They are currently
in isolation at UC Davis Hospital.)
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Peter Trei
2020-03-16 23:23:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
The USG is denying that, claiming that it is false news being spread by a foreign enemy.

Frankly, enough things have been shutdown that there are very few places around here to
gather in.

Pt
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-16 23:59:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-17 01:38:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.

We did not have the sort of nonsense that the current government is
pulling during any war in US history. If the Yankees burn down the
tavern it's one thing, for the local government to shut it down and
put its staff out of work for no good reason is quite another.
h***@gmail.com
2020-03-17 07:33:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.
Sadly it appears that he's significantly smarter than you are
Post by J. Clarke
We did not have the sort of nonsense that the current government is
pulling during any war in US history.
Yeah, the government never restricted the movements or jobs of people during any war...
Native americans, Japanese Americans may want to talk to you...

But HTF would closing businesses make sense during a war?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationing_in_the_United_States shows some of the things that were done to help the war effort
Post by J. Clarke
If the Yankees burn down the
tavern it's one thing, for the local government to shut it down and
put its staff out of work for no good reason is quite another.
There's only one thing for you to do, proudly protest by going off and dying of Covid-19
Robert Carnegie
2020-03-17 10:36:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by h***@gmail.com
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.
Sadly it appears that he's significantly smarter
than you are
I'm getting quite tired of explaining that Donald Trump
is not as stupid as he seems.

His apparent imperviousness to factual information
is just a facet of a fundamental personal dishonesty
and viciousness that ultimately stops him from
succeeding in any business except politics,
where these are career skills.
Juho Julkunen
2020-03-17 11:05:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by h***@gmail.com
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.
Sadly it appears that he's significantly smarter
than you are
I'm getting quite tired of explaining that Donald Trump
is not as stupid as he seems.
So, uh, stop?

Donald Trump is a catastrophically stupid man, in that special way only
those whose privilege insulates them from all consequences can be. The
rest of us, no matter how idiotic, can never aspire to be quite that
stupid, because we cannot afford to.
--
Juho Julkunen
Robert Carnegie
2020-03-17 20:23:24 UTC
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Post by Juho Julkunen
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by h***@gmail.com
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.
Sadly it appears that he's significantly smarter
than you are
I'm getting quite tired of explaining that Donald Trump
is not as stupid as he seems.
So, uh, stop?
Donald Trump is a catastrophically stupid man, in that special way only
those whose privilege insulates them from all consequences can be. The
rest of us, no matter how idiotic, can never aspire to be quite that
stupid, because we cannot afford to.
I don't want to award him undeserved attention - but,
watch him. Now and again the clown mask slips and
a cunning evil man is revealed.

When Kobe Bryant died, a basketball player that I doubt
President Trump held in any esteem or had even ever
heard of (I don't know, they may have been close
friends), the President spoke well of him, in as much
as I heard of that. No doubt it was written out for
him to read. But he didn't have to take it.
And I believe he didn't enjoy it, as he would have
enjoyed sneering at the inadequacy of Bryant's aircraft
and the sexual allegations that he didn't escape
while Trump did. But sneering would have been a mistake.
Paul S Person
2020-03-17 18:03:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:38:44 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.
Actually, the government has /not/ done whatever Trump decides, and
not only because the courts have prevented some of it.
Post by J. Clarke
We did not have the sort of nonsense that the current government is
pulling during any war in US history. If the Yankees burn down the
tavern it's one thing, for the local government to shut it down and
put its staff out of work for no good reason is quite another.
You never heard of Prohibition?

Or Rationing in WW2?

We, in fact, have a /long/ history of this sort of thing ... when the
situation calls for it.

And most of us think the situation calls for it.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
J. Clarke
2020-03-17 21:36:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 11:03:55 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:38:44 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.
Actually, the government has /not/ done whatever Trump decides, and
not only because the courts have prevented some of it.
Fuck Trump. I'm talking about the governors.
Post by Paul S Person
Post by J. Clarke
We did not have the sort of nonsense that the current government is
pulling during any war in US history. If the Yankees burn down the
tavern it's one thing, for the local government to shut it down and
put its staff out of work for no good reason is quite another.
You never heard of Prohibition?
Prohibition did not close restaurants, it was not a war, and it
required a Constitutional Amendment, not the order of a buffoon.
Post by Paul S Person
Or Rationing in WW2?
Did not close restaurants, did not close bars, and in this case the
problem is not a lack of production, it is buffoons in suits.
Post by Paul S Person
We, in fact, have a /long/ history of this sort of thing ... when the
situation calls for it.
And most of us think the situation calls for it.
You've taken a poll?
Kevrob
2020-03-17 23:59:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 11:03:55 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:38:44 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.
Actually, the government has /not/ done whatever Trump decides, and
not only because the courts have prevented some of it.
Fuck Trump. I'm talking about the governors.
Post by Paul S Person
Post by J. Clarke
We did not have the sort of nonsense that the current government is
pulling during any war in US history. If the Yankees burn down the
tavern it's one thing, for the local government to shut it down and
put its staff out of work for no good reason is quite another.
You never heard of Prohibition?
Prohibition did not close restaurants, it was not a war, and it
required a Constitutional Amendment, not the order of a buffoon.
Prohibition was adopted as a war measure in the US BEFORE the
Constitution was changed and the Volsted Act passed.

[quote]

While waiting for the states to ratify the 18th Amendment,
President Woodrow Wilson instituted partial Prohibition, limiting
beer to 2.75% alcohol content, and placing strict caps on total
production of alcoholic beverages.

[/quote]

https://hoover.blogs.archives.gov/2016/04/06/law-of-the-land/
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Paul S Person
Or Rationing in WW2?
Did not close restaurants, did not close bars, and in this case the
problem is not a lack of production, it is buffoons in suits.
Post by Paul S Person
We, in fact, have a /long/ history of this sort of thing ... when the
situation calls for it.
And most of us think the situation calls for it.
You've taken a poll?
Britain ordered short pub hours during wartime, and
other restrictions:

[quote]

A staunch prohibitionist, Lloyd George and his allies used the war as an
excuse to shut down pubs and breweries. Beginning with the Defense of the
Realm Act of 1914, licensing hours were restricted, eventually to just five
and a half hours a day. Prices of pints doubled as a heavy tax was put on
beer. In his fascinating book, "Brewing For Victory," Brian Glover points
out that not only was British beer production cut from 37 million barrels
in 1913 to just 19 million by 1917, the average strength of beer also
dropped from a starting gravity of 1052 in 1914 to 1030 in 1918.
Meanwhile, across the pond, the United States jumped off the abyss into
national Prohibition in 1917.

[/quote]

http://allaboutbeer.com/article/beer-goes-to-war/

"War is the health of the state." - Randolph Bourne

https://reason.com/video/coronavirus-is-the-health-of-the-state/

{The text of the narration is on that page, also,
if you'd rather read than watch.}

Kevin R
J. Clarke
2020-03-18 00:10:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by J. Clarke
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 11:03:55 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:38:44 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
No, it's like living in wartime.
No, it's like living in a banana republic. The government does
whatever the dictator decides and the dictator is an idiot.
Actually, the government has /not/ done whatever Trump decides, and
not only because the courts have prevented some of it.
Fuck Trump. I'm talking about the governors.
Post by Paul S Person
Post by J. Clarke
We did not have the sort of nonsense that the current government is
pulling during any war in US history. If the Yankees burn down the
tavern it's one thing, for the local government to shut it down and
put its staff out of work for no good reason is quite another.
You never heard of Prohibition?
Prohibition did not close restaurants, it was not a war, and it
required a Constitutional Amendment, not the order of a buffoon.
Prohibition was adopted as a war measure in the US BEFORE the
Constitution was changed and the Volsted Act passed.
[quote]
While waiting for the states to ratify the 18th Amendment,
President Woodrow Wilson instituted partial Prohibition, limiting
beer to 2.75% alcohol content, and placing strict caps on total
production of alcoholic beverages.
[/quote]
https://hoover.blogs.archives.gov/2016/04/06/law-of-the-land/
Sorry, but limiting alcohol sales to help the war effort is rationing,
not prohibition.
Post by Kevrob
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Paul S Person
Or Rationing in WW2?
Did not close restaurants, did not close bars, and in this case the
problem is not a lack of production, it is buffoons in suits.
Post by Paul S Person
We, in fact, have a /long/ history of this sort of thing ... when the
situation calls for it.
And most of us think the situation calls for it.
You've taken a poll?
Britain ordered short pub hours during wartime, and
Short. Not closed.
Post by Kevrob
[quote]
A staunch prohibitionist, Lloyd George and his allies used the war as an
excuse to shut down pubs and breweries. Beginning with the Defense of the
Realm Act of 1914, licensing hours were restricted, eventually to just five
and a half hours a day. Prices of pints doubled as a heavy tax was put on
beer. In his fascinating book, "Brewing For Victory," Brian Glover points
out that not only was British beer production cut from 37 million barrels
in 1913 to just 19 million by 1917, the average strength of beer also
dropped from a starting gravity of 1052 in 1914 to 1030 in 1918.
Meanwhile, across the pond, the United States jumped off the abyss into
national Prohibition in 1917.
[/quote]
http://allaboutbeer.com/article/beer-goes-to-war/
"War is the health of the state." - Randolph Bourne
https://reason.com/video/coronavirus-is-the-health-of-the-state/
{The text of the narration is on that page, also,
if you'd rather read than watch.}
Fuck the state.
p***@hotmail.com
2020-03-17 04:13:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
But in a banana republic at least they have bananas.

Peter Wezeman
anti-social Darwinist

"I know how to spell banana but I don't know where to stop."
Kevrob
2020-03-17 04:40:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
But in a banana republic at least they have bananas.
If we can develop a resistant strain before the blight
takes out all the Cavendish plants.

I'm going to take a shot at making chicken stock, once
my stockpile of giblets and spines from spatchcocked birds
defrosts. It'll give me something to do, at least, while
the state has us "locked down."

Kevin R
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-17 05:09:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
But in a banana republic at least they have bananas.
If we can develop a resistant strain before the blight
takes out all the Cavendish plants.
I'm going to take a shot at making chicken stock, once
my stockpile of giblets and spines from spatchcocked birds
defrosts. It'll give me something to do, at least, while
the state has us "locked down."
Go for it. Add a parsnip and a parsley, and you'll have genuine
antibiotic chicken soup. Whether it also serves as an antiviral
remains to be seen.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Kevrob
2020-03-17 05:51:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
I'm going to take a shot at making chicken stock, once
my stockpile of giblets and spines from spatchcocked birds
defrosts. It'll give me something to do, at least, while
the state has us "locked down."
Go for it. Add a parsnip and a parsley, and you'll have genuine
antibiotic chicken soup. Whether it also serves as an antiviral
remains to be seen.
I need a bunch of carrots. I could use another 5 lb bag of spuds,
but I have barley and rice. Celery would be nice. I have bay leaf.
I've made stock a couple of times before, and have a big stock pot,
useful for this task, as well as for steaming shellfish, or making
chowder. Once the stock is made, I can turn a large portion of
it into soup or stew in my crockpot (TM.) I'm going to skip doing
corned beef in the slow cooker. When I was at the market last they
didn't have a piece small enough to suit me, though the price is
right. Only cooking enough for one, I don't want to be dining
on that much processed meat, that long. I have roasted potatoes
in ther fridge, and will steam or broil some fish I've defrosted.
That's as close to "fish and chips" as I'll come in my kitchen.
I don't ever deep-fry anything. There is "oven-frying," but I
may not bother with the fuss.

Kevin R
Kevrob
2020-03-20 03:42:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
I'm going to take a shot at making chicken stock,
...
I need a bunch of carrots. .....
I managed to pick up celery, `taters & carrots, but there wasn't
a chicken to be had at two stores, at the price I'll pay
for a roaster. I did pick up a small piece of corned beef:
less than 2.5 lbs @ $1.88 per pound. The store extended their,
as they couldn't move all that salt beef with Paddy's day parties
cancelled.

I had so many frozen chicken spines that I was able to braise and
roast them, en brochette, over a bed of carrots. I loves me a
poultry rack. The veg, braised giblets and the roasted chicken
bits are all simmering in the chowder pot. I was able to make gravy
with pan drippings, also. I'll wind up with enough to make a 5-quart
crockpot of soup, and then some. However, I might not be able to
freeze what's left over, as my housemates have also stocked up on
food and the freezer is jammed. I did make some room by cooking
the chicken parts. It will be spring in minutes, and I can't
count on using my back stairs landing as an "emergency root
cellar." I suppose I could share or trade!

I also got the makings for baking a couple of pizzas - dough,
sauce, cheese, turkey pepperoni. Boneless pork chops were on sale.
Score! Milk, eggs, butter, bread and Aldi's Cheerios manque are
all tucked away. I've got turkey hot dogs for days. The choices
for frozen vegetables were meager. The only thing left from
the brand on sale was kale.

Gas has dropped to $2.29 a gallon for regular. I get a deal
at a large station group around here, so $2.19 for me. TV
news says that's the national average. We are always on the
high end.

Happy Spring! (In 8 minutes...)

https://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/march-equinox.html

Kevin R
Lynn McGuire
2020-03-20 18:15:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
I'm going to take a shot at making chicken stock,
...
I need a bunch of carrots. .....
I managed to pick up celery, `taters & carrots, but there wasn't
a chicken to be had at two stores, at the price I'll pay
as they couldn't move all that salt beef with Paddy's day parties
cancelled.
I had so many frozen chicken spines that I was able to braise and
roast them, en brochette, over a bed of carrots. I loves me a
poultry rack. The veg, braised giblets and the roasted chicken
bits are all simmering in the chowder pot. I was able to make gravy
with pan drippings, also. I'll wind up with enough to make a 5-quart
crockpot of soup, and then some. However, I might not be able to
freeze what's left over, as my housemates have also stocked up on
food and the freezer is jammed. I did make some room by cooking
the chicken parts. It will be spring in minutes, and I can't
count on using my back stairs landing as an "emergency root
cellar." I suppose I could share or trade!
I also got the makings for baking a couple of pizzas - dough,
sauce, cheese, turkey pepperoni. Boneless pork chops were on sale.
Score! Milk, eggs, butter, bread and Aldi's Cheerios manque are
all tucked away. I've got turkey hot dogs for days. The choices
for frozen vegetables were meager. The only thing left from
the brand on sale was kale.
Gas has dropped to $2.29 a gallon for regular. I get a deal
at a large station group around here, so $2.19 for me. TV
news says that's the national average. We are always on the
high end.
Happy Spring! (In 8 minutes...)
https://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/march-equinox.html
Kevin R
Gasoline is $1.75/gallon here at the Shell on the corner of our two
country roads.

I am predicting gasoline at $1.00/gal by Memorial Day. The oil and gas
industry in the USA will be bankrupt by Christmas.

Lynn
James Nicoll
2020-03-20 18:29:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Gasoline is $1.75/gallon here at the Shell on the corner of our two
country roads.
I am predicting gasoline at $1.00/gal by Memorial Day. The oil and gas
industry in the USA will be bankrupt by Christmas.
See? Providence protected you from those nasty treehuggers making gasoline
super expensive.
--
My reviews can be found at http://jamesdavisnicoll.com/
My tor pieces at https://www.tor.com/author/james-davis-nicoll/
My Dreamwidth at https://james-davis-nicoll.dreamwidth.org/
My patreon is at https://www.patreon.com/jamesdnicoll
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-20 20:31:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Lynn McGuire
Gasoline is $1.75/gallon here at the Shell on the corner of our two
country roads.
I am predicting gasoline at $1.00/gal by Memorial Day. The oil and gas
industry in the USA will be bankrupt by Christmas.
See? Providence protected you from those nasty treehuggers making gasoline
super expensive.
Around here, gas is around three dollars a gallon. Down from
about three and a half.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Kevrob
2020-03-20 21:35:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Lynn McGuire
Gasoline is $1.75/gallon here at the Shell on the corner of our two
country roads.
I am predicting gasoline at $1.00/gal by Memorial Day. The oil and gas
industry in the USA will be bankrupt by Christmas.
See? Providence protected you from those nasty treehuggers making gasoline
super expensive.
Around here, gas is around three dollars a gallon. Down from
about three and a half.
--
Comparing retail gas prices across the US is complicated by
the varying seasonal formulations and differing levels of
state and local taxes. We have the country's 7th highest gas
tax and there isn't a refinery in the state, which elevates
prices. It all has to come in from other states, raising costs.

AAA is reporting:

[quote]

National Gas Price Average at Cheapest Level Since 2016
March 20,2020

Since Monday, the national average for a gallon of regular unleaded
gasoline has declined by eight cents to $2.17. The national average
has not been this cheap since December 2016. Today, 19 states have
averages under $2/gallon. Pump prices continue to decline around the
country as oil prices have decreased significantly in response to the
increasing public health and economic impact of COVID-19 and the crude
price war between Russia and Saudi Arabia. Although new data from the
Energy Information Administration shows that demand increased to 9.7
million b/d from 9.4 million b/d last week, while total domestic supply
decreased by 6.2 million bbl to 240.8 million bbl, COVID-19 has forced
gas prices down dramatically.

[/quote]

https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/

Your state's average prices, here:

https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/

CA is even higher than HI!

Kevin R
Kevrob
2020-03-20 21:50:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.

CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.

Kevin R
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-20 23:49:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Dimensional Traveler
2020-03-21 00:51:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
California also has different, stricter, standards that effectively
require refining specifically for the state. That's one of the reasons
CA has as many refineries as it does.
--
"You need to believe in things that aren't true. How else can they become?"
Kevrob
2020-03-21 01:19:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.

[quote]

Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.

[/quote] - Robert Krol

https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf

Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.

https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/

Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.

Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.

Kevin R
J. Clarke
2020-03-21 01:32:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
If I believed in a deity, I would pray "Dear Lord, please open up the
Earth and swallow Ned Lamont."
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-21 02:12:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
If I believed in a deity, I would pray "Dear Lord, please open up the
Earth and swallow Ned Lamont."
Ned Lamont will die.

Eventually.

Take comfort in that.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-21 02:57:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
If I believed in a deity, I would pray "Dear Lord, please open up the
Earth and swallow Ned Lamont."
Ned Lamont will die.
Eventually.
Take comfort in that.
But not soon enough that:
(a) The damage he does is limited to a reasonable level and
(b) I can pee on his grave.
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-21 03:23:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
If I believed in a deity, I would pray "Dear Lord, please open up the
Earth and swallow Ned Lamont."
Ned Lamont will die.
Eventually.
Take comfort in that.
(a) The damage he does is limited to a reasonable level and
(b) I can pee on his grave.
How old is he? How old are you? How healthy are your kidneys?
(I don't inquire about his kidneys, since I don't suppose you
know.)
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-21 03:53:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
If I believed in a deity, I would pray "Dear Lord, please open up the
Earth and swallow Ned Lamont."
Ned Lamont will die.
Eventually.
Take comfort in that.
(a) The damage he does is limited to a reasonable level and
(b) I can pee on his grave.
How old is he? How old are you? How healthy are your kidneys?
(I don't inquire about his kidneys, since I don't suppose you
know.)
He's a year younger than I am. As for my kidneys, hell if I know. I
think I need a new doctor--the one I have doesn't actually tell me
anything I don't already know.
Paul S Person
2020-03-21 16:42:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Fri, 20 Mar 2020 23:53:33 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
If I believed in a deity, I would pray "Dear Lord, please open up the
Earth and swallow Ned Lamont."
Ned Lamont will die.
Eventually.
Take comfort in that.
(a) The damage he does is limited to a reasonable level and
(b) I can pee on his grave.
How old is he? How old are you? How healthy are your kidneys?
(I don't inquire about his kidneys, since I don't suppose you
know.)
He's a year younger than I am. As for my kidneys, hell if I know. I
think I need a new doctor--the one I have doesn't actually tell me
anything I don't already know.
But he still gets paid for it, right?

So, why should he learn something new?
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-21 02:11:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.

And the High-Occupancy-Vehile lanes -- leftmost lane, ordinarily
restricted to cars holding two or three humans, depending on
which freeway it is-- are now being set up with transponders of
their own, and you pay a buck or two per mile for the privilege
of driving on them.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-21 02:58:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
And the High-Occupancy-Vehile lanes -- leftmost lane, ordinarily
restricted to cars holding two or three humans, depending on
which freeway it is-- are now being set up with transponders of
their own, and you pay a buck or two per mile for the privilege
of driving on them.
And the government thinks it's Robin Hood when it's really the Sheriff
of Nottingham.
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-21 03:24:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
And the High-Occupancy-Vehile lanes -- leftmost lane, ordinarily
restricted to cars holding two or three humans, depending on
which freeway it is-- are now being set up with transponders of
their own, and you pay a buck or two per mile for the privilege
of driving on them.
And the government thinks it's Robin Hood when it's really the Sheriff
of Nottingham.
No, it's the crew of peasants who keep sweeping the horse apples
up off the road.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-21 03:52:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
And the High-Occupancy-Vehile lanes -- leftmost lane, ordinarily
restricted to cars holding two or three humans, depending on
which freeway it is-- are now being set up with transponders of
their own, and you pay a buck or two per mile for the privilege
of driving on them.
And the government thinks it's Robin Hood when it's really the Sheriff
of Nottingham.
No, it's the crew of peasants who keep sweeping the horse apples
up off the road.
It hires menials to do that.
Kevrob
2020-03-21 05:49:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
No, it's the crew of peasants who keep sweeping the horse apples
up off the road.
It hires menials to do that.
Back in the day, it just used the corvee.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corvee

It is still used in some countries.

Kevin R
Kevrob
2020-03-21 03:46:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
We have all the tolled bridges in and out of the boroughs of
nearby New York, to our southwest, along with tunnels, and the
ones between NY and NJ. The NY MTA and the Port Authority run
those. If you live in CT and work in NY, that's just a cost
of making a living, usually at a higher salary than one might
make locally.

Lamont was planning to toll 14 bridges. We have bridges over
various rivers, which people have to use, even if they don't
make much.
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
And the High-Occupancy-Vehile lanes -- leftmost lane, ordinarily
restricted to cars holding two or three humans, depending on
which freeway it is-- are now being set up with transponders of
their own, and you pay a buck or two per mile for the privilege
of driving on them.
CT only has HOV lanes on the interstate near Hartford. There's
not enough capacity on I-95 for those, and little room to add
lanes for the purpose.
Post by J. Clarke
And the government thinks it's Robin Hood when it's really the
Sheriff of Nottingham.
Kevin R
Paul S Person
2020-03-21 16:47:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
We have all the tolled bridges in and out of the boroughs of
nearby New York, to our southwest, along with tunnels, and the
ones between NY and NJ. The NY MTA and the Port Authority run
those. If you live in CT and work in NY, that's just a cost
of making a living, usually at a higher salary than one might
make locally.
Lamont was planning to toll 14 bridges. We have bridges over
various rivers, which people have to use, even if they don't
make much.
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
And the High-Occupancy-Vehile lanes -- leftmost lane, ordinarily
restricted to cars holding two or three humans, depending on
which freeway it is-- are now being set up with transponders of
their own, and you pay a buck or two per mile for the privilege
of driving on them.
CT only has HOV lanes on the interstate near Hartford. There's
not enough capacity on I-95 for those, and little room to add
lanes for the purpose.
Sounds like it's time to find a /completely new route/, and replace
I-95 with something newer! bigger! better! more expensive!

And don't forget to include either bus-only lanes or light rail
tracks!
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Kevrob
2020-03-21 17:06:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Kevrob
CT only has HOV lanes on the interstate near Hartford. There's
not enough capacity on I-95 for those, and little room to add
lanes for the purpose.
Sounds like it's time to find a /completely new route/, and replace
I-95 with something newer! bigger! better! more expensive!
And don't forget to include either bus-only lanes or light rail
tracks!
There's no room anywhere for a comparable-size highway.
The power of NIMBY is strong here. I suppose State Route
15 could be expanded, but that is the scenic Merritt Pkwy
and the Wilbur Cross Pkwy [RTE 15], and the portion north
of New Haven does not serve the Shoreline, as it veers north.

In the past, people have proposed putting truck trailers on
barges ans shipping them parallel to the shore route on the
Long Island Sound. That's how unrealistic a new interstate
route is.

Kevin R
Scott Lurndal
2020-03-21 16:40:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
The benicia bridge also accepts cash. Although as of today,
all bay area cash booths are closed and they'll bill drivers without
toll transceivers via the registered driver's snail mail.
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-21 19:42:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
The benicia bridge also accepts cash. Although as of today,
all bay area cash booths are closed and they'll bill drivers without
toll transceivers via the registered driver's snail mail.
Correct; but without charging the driver a "you zoomed through
the booth without paying" fee.

My daughter, who takes the Carquinez bridge daily, reports that
SOME of the human toll-takers wore gloves, SOME of them wore
masks. Not all. The use-Fastrak-or-your-license-plate-gets-
photographed strategy, I think, is going to work; the driver will
pay the same toll in either case.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Paul S Person
2020-03-22 16:15:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
The benicia bridge also accepts cash. Although as of today,
all bay area cash booths are closed and they'll bill drivers without
toll transceivers via the registered driver's snail mail.
Correct; but without charging the driver a "you zoomed through
the booth without paying" fee.
My daughter, who takes the Carquinez bridge daily, reports that
SOME of the human toll-takers wore gloves, SOME of them wore
masks. Not all. The use-Fastrak-or-your-license-plate-gets-
photographed strategy, I think, is going to work; the driver will
pay the same toll in either case.
Ahhhh ... the people-in-charge are missing an opportunity!

Up hear, those /not/ using transponders not only get billed for the
trip, they get a surcharge as well.

Of course, there was the minor problem where a transponder reader
failed and lots of people got billed for surcharges as a result.

But that's a /lot/ better than some of the earlier problems.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-22 17:39:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
The benicia bridge also accepts cash. Although as of today,
all bay area cash booths are closed and they'll bill drivers without
toll transceivers via the registered driver's snail mail.
Correct; but without charging the driver a "you zoomed through
the booth without paying" fee.
My daughter, who takes the Carquinez bridge daily, reports that
SOME of the human toll-takers wore gloves, SOME of them wore
masks. Not all. The use-Fastrak-or-your-license-plate-gets-
photographed strategy, I think, is going to work; the driver will
pay the same toll in either case.
Ahhhh ... the people-in-charge are missing an opportunity!
Up hear, those /not/ using transponders not only get billed for the
trip, they get a surcharge as well.
Well, in California we are more enlightened than that. Under
ordinary circumstances, you can have a FasTrak transponder, or
you can pay cash. Under these extraordinary circumstances, we
proceed as listed above.

Of course, California has a largish budget surplus at the moment;
no one knows how long that will last.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Lynn McGuire
2020-03-22 22:51:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
The benicia bridge also accepts cash. Although as of today,
all bay area cash booths are closed and they'll bill drivers without
toll transceivers via the registered driver's snail mail.
Correct; but without charging the driver a "you zoomed through
the booth without paying" fee.
My daughter, who takes the Carquinez bridge daily, reports that
SOME of the human toll-takers wore gloves, SOME of them wore
masks. Not all. The use-Fastrak-or-your-license-plate-gets-
photographed strategy, I think, is going to work; the driver will
pay the same toll in either case.
Ahhhh ... the people-in-charge are missing an opportunity!
Up hear, those /not/ using transponders not only get billed for the
trip, they get a surcharge as well.
Well, in California we are more enlightened than that. Under
ordinary circumstances, you can have a FasTrak transponder, or
you can pay cash. Under these extraordinary circumstances, we
proceed as listed above.
Of course, California has a largish budget surplus at the moment;
no one knows how long that will last.
Or if it is even true. #BlackMagicAccounting. All 50 states use it.
Otherwise the state debts would be decreasing.

Lynn
Alan Baker
2020-03-22 22:56:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again.  You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
The benicia bridge also accepts cash.   Although as of today,
all bay area cash booths are closed and they'll bill drivers without
toll transceivers via the registered driver's snail mail.
Correct; but without charging the driver a "you zoomed through
the booth without paying" fee.
My daughter, who takes the Carquinez bridge daily, reports that
SOME of the human toll-takers wore gloves, SOME of them wore
masks.  Not all.  The use-Fastrak-or-your-license-plate-gets-
photographed strategy, I think, is going to work; the driver will
pay the same toll in either case.
Ahhhh ... the people-in-charge are missing an opportunity!
Up hear, those /not/ using transponders not only get billed for the
trip, they get a surcharge as well.
Well, in California we are more enlightened than that.  Under
ordinary circumstances, you can have a FasTrak transponder, or
you can pay cash.  Under these extraordinary circumstances, we
proceed as listed above.
Of course, California has a largish budget surplus at the moment;
no one knows how long that will last.
Or if it is even true.  #BlackMagicAccounting.  All 50 states use it.
Otherwise the state debts would be decreasing.
Lynn
So not knowing if it's true...

...you simply declare it to be true.
Kevrob
2020-03-22 23:32:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan Baker
Or if it is even true.  #BlackMagicAccounting.  All 50 states use it.
Otherwise the state debts would be decreasing.
Lynn
So not knowing if it's true...
...you simply declare it to be true.
US States engaging in "funny numbers" is the rule, not the
exception. I'll let any Golden Staters point out what nonsense
Sacramento may be up to.

https://www.accountingtoday.com/opinion/government-financial-planning-with-inaccurate-financial-information

Kevin R
Chrysi Cat
2020-03-22 23:36:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan Baker
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again.  You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
The benicia bridge also accepts cash.   Although as of today,
all bay area cash booths are closed and they'll bill drivers without
toll transceivers via the registered driver's snail mail.
Correct; but without charging the driver a "you zoomed through
the booth without paying" fee.
My daughter, who takes the Carquinez bridge daily, reports that
SOME of the human toll-takers wore gloves, SOME of them wore
masks.  Not all.  The use-Fastrak-or-your-license-plate-gets-
photographed strategy, I think, is going to work; the driver will
pay the same toll in either case.
Ahhhh ... the people-in-charge are missing an opportunity!
Up hear, those /not/ using transponders not only get billed for the
trip, they get a surcharge as well.
Well, in California we are more enlightened than that.  Under
ordinary circumstances, you can have a FasTrak transponder, or
you can pay cash.  Under these extraordinary circumstances, we
proceed as listed above.
Of course, California has a largish budget surplus at the moment;
no one knows how long that will last.
Or if it is even true.  #BlackMagicAccounting.  All 50 states use it.
Otherwise the state debts would be decreasing.
Lynn
So not knowing if it's true...
...you simply declare it to be true.
I know, it's almost as though Shawn Wilson never left, innit?
--
Chrysi Cat
1/2 anthrocat, nearly 1/2 anthrofox, all magical
Transgoddess, quick to anger.
Call me Chrysi or call me Kat, I'll respond to either!
Paul S Person
2020-03-21 16:44:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
One of the things we have quite a few of in the Bay Area is
bridges, and they all charge a toll -- in one direction only, on
the assumption that if your commute takes you out one way, the
countercommute will bring you back again. You can pay cash ($6
for the Carquinez Strait bridge), or you can get a Fastrak
transponder and drive straight through.
And the High-Occupancy-Vehile lanes -- leftmost lane, ordinarily
restricted to cars holding two or three humans, depending on
which freeway it is-- are now being set up with transponders of
their own, and you pay a buck or two per mile for the privilege
of driving on them.
Well, /that/ should cut down on the number of "passengers" who are
actually mannequins. Or worse.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Scott Lurndal
2020-03-21 16:38:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-s=
ince-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
=20
=20
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
=20
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
=20
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
=20
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
=20
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali[fornia] is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.=20
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Kevrob
2020-03-21 16:46:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)

Kevin R
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-21 19:45:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-21 21:21:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
An idea that appeals only to people who live in urbanized states.
Basically getting rid of it means that you get to dictate terms to the
non-urbanized states.
Gary R. Schmidt
2020-03-22 09:32:51 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
An idea that appeals only to people who live in urbanized states.
Basically getting rid of it means that you get to dictate terms to the
non-urbanized states.
Maybe you should get rid of a system that was designed to prevent people
from voting in the first place...

Cheers,
Gary B-)
--
Waiting for a new signature to suggest itself...
J. Clarke
2020-03-22 11:05:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 22 Mar 2020 20:32:51 +1100, "Gary R. Schmidt"
Post by Gary R. Schmidt
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
An idea that appeals only to people who live in urbanized states.
Basically getting rid of it means that you get to dictate terms to the
non-urbanized states.
Maybe you should get rid of a system that was designed to prevent people
from voting in the first place...
What system would that be?
Magewolf
2020-03-22 17:20:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
An idea that appeals only to people who live in urbanized states.
Basically getting rid of it means that you get to dictate terms to the
non-urbanized states.
States are not people. Does living in North Dakota magically make your
vote more important then someone living in New York?
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-22 17:42:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Magewolf
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
An idea that appeals only to people who live in urbanized states.
Basically getting rid of it means that you get to dictate terms to the
non-urbanized states.
States are not people. Does living in North Dakota magically make your
vote more important then someone living in New York?
The people in North Dakota would probably like to think so.

The whole Electoral College setup was put in place to reassure
the states that they were still going to count as *formerly
independent nations,* sort of.

That idea lost out in the 1860s.

My late father-in-law used to say that the Civil War was fought
over one word: "The United States are a nation" vs. "The United
States is a nation."
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-22 20:25:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Magewolf
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
An idea that appeals only to people who live in urbanized states.
Basically getting rid of it means that you get to dictate terms to the
non-urbanized states.
States are not people. Does living in North Dakota magically make your
vote more important then someone living in New York?
The people in North Dakota would probably like to think so.
Since a person living in New York very likely has not the slightest
notion what life is like for someone in North Dakota, if North Dakota
doesn't get a reasonable say then the New Yorkers will pass laws that
work find in a big city but are nonsense in North Dakota. This is a
problem which "democratic" societies are going to have to deal with
sooner or later--the majority of voters are in the city--eventually
they're going to legislate farming out of existence because none of
them have the slightest clue what is needed to maintain a farm and end
up starving to death.

One solution to this is to limit the powers of government. Another is
to give the farmers enough say to have a reasonable chance that the
city folks won't pass laws that prevent them from operating or raise
their costs to an unreasonable level. I'm sure there are others.
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
The whole Electoral College setup was put in place to reassure
the states that they were still going to count as *formerly
independent nations,* sort of.
That idea lost out in the 1860s.
Tell that to Hillary Clinton.
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
My late father-in-law used to say that the Civil War was fought
over one word: "The United States are a nation" vs. "The United
States is a nation."
Kevrob
2020-03-22 20:26:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Magewolf
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
An idea that appeals only to people who live in urbanized states.
Basically getting rid of it means that you get to dictate terms to the
non-urbanized states.
States are not people. Does living in North Dakota magically make your
vote more important then someone living in New York?
The people in North Dakota would probably like to think so.
The whole Electoral College setup was put in place to reassure
the states that they were still going to count as *formerly
independent nations,* sort of.
That idea lost out in the 1860s.
"Dual sovereignty" is a doctrine that still exists, if in
rudimentary form. It's why a Supreme Court ruling might
not strike a law down as unconstitutional, but a particular
state supreme court might do so: a clause in the state
constitution recognizes ore extensive rights. It also makes
a mockery of double jeopardy. The same act is seen as two
different crimes, one against state law, and one against Federal
law.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Jeopardy_Clause#Dual_sovereignty_doctrine
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
My late father-in-law used to say that the Civil War was fought
over one word: "The United States are a nation" vs. "The United
States is a nation."
That is a truism commented upon by the likes of James McPherson,
Shelby Foote, and others.

See:

https://www.grammarphobia.com/blog/2007/04/why-is-the-u-s-singular.html

Some are still fighting a rear guard action against
"The US _is_."

I can safely say "Our great compound Republic is..."
without taking sides. :)

Kevin R
Paul S Person
2020-03-22 16:27:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
I would start by getting rid of the /Electors/. Each State has an
office that declares the results of an election -- they can just
report the number of Electoral votes and who they are for directly.

That will take care of the "unfaithful elector" problem.

Another useful change would be tie one Electoral vote to each
District. No more "winner takes all".

The two State Electoral votes could then be restructured as follows:

normally, they are split between the candidates that came in first and
second in the number of popular votes

but, if a candidate got at least 60% + 1 of the votes, both go to that
candidate.

And then we can talk about making the Districts /truly/ represent the
/people/, rather than giving each State at least one.

But I /like/ the Electoral system.

And, BTW, if we had used a direct system in 2016, /neither/ candidate
would have won because /neither/ candidate got a majority. There would
have had to be a run-off. Which would cause its own problems.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Kevrob
2020-03-22 17:33:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
I would start by getting rid of the /Electors/. Each State has an
office that declares the results of an election -- they can just
report the number of Electoral votes and who they are for directly.
That will take care of the "unfaithful elector" problem.
"Unfaithful electors" are a feature, not a bug, when,
between the first Tuesday in November and the day in
December when the Electors meet in the several states,
it becomes apparent the nominee one is pledged to is
manifestly unqualified for the office. The specific
instance I have in mind was Nixon in 1972, when news
about Watergate kept breaking. VA's Roger McBride voted
for Hospers/Nathan. 2 Texas electors chose candidates other
than Trump. 35 more defections from the Donald, and the
election would have been thrown into the House, and we might
have been spared the Coral Calamity.
Post by Paul S Person
Another useful change would be tie one Electoral vote to each
District. No more "winner takes all".
Maine and Nebraska do that. Only the electors allotted for
the Senate seats are statewide votes.
Post by Paul S Person
normally, they are split between the candidates that came in first and
second in the number of popular votes
but, if a candidate got at least 60% + 1 of the votes, both go to that
candidate.
I like that.
Post by Paul S Person
And then we can talk about making the Districts /truly/ represent the
/people/, rather than giving each State at least one.
The least worst way to do that is to increase the size of the House.
Districts now average 700k in population.
Post by Paul S Person
But I /like/ the Electoral system.
And, BTW, if we had used a direct system in 2016, /neither/ candidate
would have won because /neither/ candidate got a majority. There would
have had to be a run-off. Which would cause its own problems.
See: France.

That system suits a unitary state more than a Federal one,
as regards electing a chief executive.

Kevin R
J. Clarke
2020-03-22 20:27:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
I would start by getting rid of the /Electors/. Each State has an
office that declares the results of an election -- they can just
report the number of Electoral votes and who they are for directly.
That will take care of the "unfaithful elector" problem.
"Unfaithful electors" are a feature, not a bug, when,
between the first Tuesday in November and the day in
December when the Electors meet in the several states,
it becomes apparent the nominee one is pledged to is
manifestly unqualified for the office. The specific
instance I have in mind was Nixon in 1972, when news
about Watergate kept breaking. VA's Roger McBride voted
for Hospers/Nathan. 2 Texas electors chose candidates other
than Trump. 35 more defections from the Donald, and the
election would have been thrown into the House, and we might
have been spared the Coral Calamity.
Post by Paul S Person
Another useful change would be tie one Electoral vote to each
District. No more "winner takes all".
Maine and Nebraska do that. Only the electors allotted for
the Senate seats are statewide votes.
Post by Paul S Person
normally, they are split between the candidates that came in first and
second in the number of popular votes
but, if a candidate got at least 60% + 1 of the votes, both go to that
candidate.
I like that.
Post by Paul S Person
And then we can talk about making the Districts /truly/ represent the
/people/, rather than giving each State at least one.
The least worst way to do that is to increase the size of the House.
Districts now average 700k in population.
The trouble is that the House is already too big to function. The
more legs a committee has the smaller its brain.
Post by Kevrob
Post by Paul S Person
But I /like/ the Electoral system.
And, BTW, if we had used a direct system in 2016, /neither/ candidate
would have won because /neither/ candidate got a majority. There would
have had to be a run-off. Which would cause its own problems.
See: France.
That system suits a unitary state more than a Federal one,
as regards electing a chief executive.
Kevin R
Kevrob
2020-03-22 21:54:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Kevrob
The least worst way to do that is to increase the size of the House.
Districts now average 700k in population.
The trouble is that the House is already too big to function. The
more legs a committee has the smaller its brain.
I loathe the idea of increasing the number of congresscritters,
but the original plan was for electors in a district to have
some, often personal, knowledge of who they were sending to the
House. Senators were chosen by state legislators the voters knew,
until the 17th Amendment took effect.

US Representatives have ~7 times or more as many constituents
as members of Canada's lower House, and ~10 times as many as
MPs at Westminster.

If we sent ~2,500 to the House, rather than 435 and paid them all
a fifth of what they now make, and no additional staff and office
budget, that would please me. The Congress would have to retract
its assumed authority within constitutional limits, and the members
return to the part-time status of the 19th century, with a lot of
one-termers who didn't get renominated by their parties. "It's
George's turn to go to Congress" was the way it worked, and after
that turn George might run for mayor or Governor or go back
to his law practice with the cachet of "the Honorable" in front
of his name for the rest of his life.

I'd like to port a condition over from L. Neil Smith's
"The Probability Broach" - The capital of the North American
Confederacy is kept at mid-19th century levels of comfort,
so that nobody would actually want to live there, and so that
the infrequent congressional sessions would be short.

Various commentators have pointed out the correlation between
metastasized government in the US and the inventions of air
conditioning and long distance jet airliner service. :)

Kevin R
J. Clarke
2020-03-22 23:44:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Kevrob
The least worst way to do that is to increase the size of the House.
Districts now average 700k in population.
The trouble is that the House is already too big to function. The
more legs a committee has the smaller its brain.
I loathe the idea of increasing the number of congresscritters,
but the original plan was for electors in a district to have
some, often personal, knowledge of who they were sending to the
House. Senators were chosen by state legislators the voters knew,
until the 17th Amendment took effect.
US Representatives have ~7 times or more as many constituents
as members of Canada's lower House, and ~10 times as many as
MPs at Westminster.
If we sent ~2,500 to the House, rather than 435 and paid them all
a fifth of what they now make, and no additional staff and office
budget, that would please me. The Congress would have to retract
its assumed authority within constitutional limits, and the members
return to the part-time status of the 19th century, with a lot of
one-termers who didn't get renominated by their parties.
I would like to see it be unlawful for any elected official to own or
rent property in DC and to treat any provision of lodging for them by
any party other than the government to be treated as bribery. I would
like to see them provided a barracks. I would like the US military to
take a vote every year on the worst barracks in the service and people
responsible for that barracks put in charge of the one maintained for
Congress, with the same budget as the bad barracks adjusted as
appropriate for the number of persons housed.
Post by Kevrob
"It's
George's turn to go to Congress" was the way it worked, and after
that turn George might run for mayor or Governor or go back
to his law practice with the cachet of "the Honorable" in front
of his name for the rest of his life.
I would prefer that no Congresscritter ever be regarded as "Honorable"
and that "Contempt of Congress" be the expected state of mind of any
reasonable person.
Post by Kevrob
I'd like to port a condition over from L. Neil Smith's
"The Probability Broach" - The capital of the North American
Confederacy is kept at mid-19th century levels of comfort,
so that nobody would actually want to live there, and so that
the infrequent congressional sessions would be short.
That's a good one. I would also like to see the meeting place of
Congress rotate rather than having it always be in one place allowing
the cockroaches^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^Hlobbyists to build
infrastructure. Maybe have it meet on a different army post every
year and stay in the barracks, with the displaced troopers put up in a
four-star hotel.
Post by Kevrob
Various commentators have pointed out the correlation between
metastasized government in the US and the inventions of air
conditioning and long distance jet airliner service. :)
J. Clarke
2020-03-22 17:48:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 22 Mar 2020 09:27:00 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Scott Lurndal
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Easy solution: repeal the 16th amendment, and Federal spending
from direct taxes without apportionment becomes unconstitutional,
once again. :)
If we go around amending things, how about getting rid of the
Electoral College?
I would start by getting rid of the /Electors/. Each State has an
office that declares the results of an election -- they can just
report the number of Electoral votes and who they are for directly.
That will take care of the "unfaithful elector" problem.
Another useful change would be tie one Electoral vote to each
District. No more "winner takes all".
normally, they are split between the candidates that came in first and
second in the number of popular votes
but, if a candidate got at least 60% + 1 of the votes, both go to that
candidate.
And then we can talk about making the Districts /truly/ represent the
/people/, rather than giving each State at least one.
But I /like/ the Electoral system.
And, BTW, if we had used a direct system in 2016, /neither/ candidate
would have won because /neither/ candidate got a majority. There would
have had to be a run-off. Which would cause its own problems.
Personally I would prefer that we elect electors as electors, not as
proxies. We vote for somebody whose name we know who tells us what he
or she is about. Then the electors pick a President and a Vice
President using some set of rules that the electors work out for
themselves, that does not require them to support any particular
person or political party.

I would hope that their rules include such provisions as anyone
declaring him- or her- self a "candidate" would be disqualified unless
it was clear that they were either being facetious or trying to avoid
the office; no elector can be President; each elector must meet
personally with every candidate under such circumstances as would
allow a good feel for his or her character. The College could conduct
its own polling to determine how the public would react to particular
candidates once they have narrowed the field but that polling would
not need to be binding.

The problem with our current system is that the people who elect the
President never meet the candidate personally, most of them anyway,
and if they do it's very briefly, so all we know is their public
personas.
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-21 19:44:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-s=
ince-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
=20
=20
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
=20
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
=20
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
=20
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
=20
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali[fornia] is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.=20
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
Because there are more Californians who pay high taxes (because
they make more money) than in red states.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Paul S Person
2020-03-22 16:19:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-s=
ince-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
=20
=20
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
=20
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
=20
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
=20
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
=20
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali[fornia] is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.=20
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
That's going to be true in any State with /some/ counties having big
cities and being economic powerhouses, and /other/ counties having
mostly wheat and cows: the richer counties subsidize the poorer
counties.

Guess which set favors which party?

But, you know, that's the /point/ of having higher-level governments:
to spread the wealth a bit. In this state, a lot of the money flowing
into the East is used to support the schools, and who can argue with
that?
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
J. Clarke
2020-03-22 17:49:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 22 Mar 2020 09:19:08 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Scott Lurndal
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-s=
ince-2016/
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
=20
=20
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
=20
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
=20
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
=20
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
=20
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali[fornia] is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.=20
Although California taxpayers pay more to the federal government
than the state gets back from the federal government. That's
not true for most red states.
That's going to be true in any State with /some/ counties having big
cities and being economic powerhouses, and /other/ counties having
mostly wheat and cows: the richer counties subsidize the poorer
counties.
Guess which set favors which party?
to spread the wealth a bit. In this state, a lot of the money flowing
into the East is used to support the schools, and who can argue with
that?
Well, apparently the schools aren't essential. I suspect a lot of
towns are going to have a budget surplus this year.
Paul S Person
2020-03-21 16:40:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/national-gas-price-average-at-cheapest-level-since-2016/
Post by Kevrob
https://gasprices.aaa.com/state-gas-price-averages/
CA is even higher than HI!
Correction. I had distraction-induced temporary dyslexia.
HI is still on the top of the "priciest" list.
Makes sense. It all has to be shipped or flown out there.
Post by Kevrob
CA has higher gas than any of the other contiguous 48, though.
Oh, yes. Does the price per gallon include our rather high gas
tax? Which is used to maintain the highway network. (Keep in
mind also that California is rather larger than many other
states.)
I've never been able to find a comparison of pre-tax gas
prices from state to state. Yes, Cali is large, but it
is also the most populous state, and the feds kick in a lot
for road building.
[quote]
Between 2005 and 2014, the federal government funded close to 40
percent of total state and local highway spending. Most of these
federal expenditures take the form of grants or loan subsidies for
new highway construction. Washington funded 86 percent of state and
local capital spending over the 2005–2014 period.
[/quote] - Robert Krol
https://www.mercatus.org/system/files/krol-federal-highway-funding-mop-mercatus-v1.pdf
Both of our high-gas-tax-states spend in the top-10 per "lane-mile."
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends in the
middle of the pack.
https://reason.org/policy-study/24th-annual-highway-report/total-disbursements-per-mile/
Texas is larger than California, if less populous, but spends
in the middle of the pack.
Our governor is trying to get tolls on I-95, between NY and RI,
and on the route from New Haven to Springfield, MA. The money
would not be used to reduce the gas tax, but to deal with debt.
There's an attempt to make this a "hello, stranger" tax, restricted
to trucks, but people expect that, once the license-plate readers
are installed and the billing system set up, tolls will be
extended to everybody. CT is small enough that people routinely
drive out of state, and it isn't practical to avoid the interstates
for that, and for most commuting, once that's again allowed.
Local experience with this sort of tolling would suggest:

* pick the vendor carefully

* be prepared for initial startup problems, like clearly unrealistic
bills (with accompanying bad publicity and lawsuits)

* keep pounding on the vendor until he/she/it (most likely it, that
is, a business with more than one employee) finally gets it right
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Lynn McGuire
2020-03-20 21:13:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by James Nicoll
Post by Lynn McGuire
Gasoline is $1.75/gallon here at the Shell on the corner of our two
country roads.
I am predicting gasoline at $1.00/gal by Memorial Day. The oil and gas
industry in the USA will be bankrupt by Christmas.
See? Providence protected you from those nasty treehuggers making gasoline
super expensive.
The day is not yet over. Although, the USA peoples tolerance for
$1.00/gallon CO2 taxes may be infinitesimally small at the moment.

Lynn
Juho Julkunen
2020-03-17 10:19:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
But in a banana republic at least they have bananas.
Well, not really, since they are sold abroad.
--
Juho Julkunen
J. Clarke
2020-03-17 11:53:34 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
But in a banana republic at least they have bananas.
For export only.
Paul S Person
2020-03-17 17:54:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:15:11 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
This is being actively denigrated and has been attributed to an
unnamed foreign power.

One of Trump's friends, no doubt. Mustn't get him riled up.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
J. Clarke
2020-03-17 21:37:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 10:54:10 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:15:11 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
This is being actively denigrated and has been attributed to an
unnamed foreign power.
One of Trump's friends, no doubt. Mustn't get him riled up.
Attributed by who to an unnamed foreign power and "actively
denigrated" by who? Do you have a statement from anybody who would
actually be in a position to know?
Peter Trei
2020-03-17 22:52:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 10:54:10 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:15:11 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
This is being actively denigrated and has been attributed to an
unnamed foreign power.
One of Trump's friends, no doubt. Mustn't get him riled up.
Attributed by who to an unnamed foreign power and "actively
denigrated" by who? Do you have a statement from anybody who would
actually be in a position to know?
Here's one story, doesn't give a source of the rumor, but it's denied by the NSC.

https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEI47BiOmJJ3W-BPgyfOv_rgqGQgEKhAIACoHCAow2Nb3CjDivdcCMMPf7gU?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3Aen

I heard claims of foreign sources, but no evidence. Could just be American a**holes.

Pt
J. Clarke
2020-03-18 00:12:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 15:52:39 -0700 (PDT), Peter Trei
Post by Peter Trei
Post by J. Clarke
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 10:54:10 -0700, Paul S Person
Post by Paul S Person
On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:15:11 -0400, J. Clarke
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
There is a rumor, which I hope is false, that the Federal government
is going to implement some kind of "lockdown" sometime in the next
several days.
It's like living in a banana republic.
This is being actively denigrated and has been attributed to an
unnamed foreign power.
One of Trump's friends, no doubt. Mustn't get him riled up.
Attributed by who to an unnamed foreign power and "actively
denigrated" by who? Do you have a statement from anybody who would
actually be in a position to know?
Here's one story, doesn't give a source of the rumor, but it's denied by the NSC.
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEI47BiOmJJ3W-BPgyfOv_rgqGQgEKhAIACoHCAow2Nb3CjDivdcCMMPf7gU?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3Aen
I heard claims of foreign sources, but no evidence. Could just be American a**holes.
Wait a minute, the "White House National Security Council" claims
"FAKE"? Now I'm concerned.
Titus G
2020-03-20 04:43:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
It's like living in a banana republic.
Unless in favour of those selling the bananas, living in a banana
republic means virtual slavery or murder from weapons supplied by those
buying the bananas.
Paul S Person
2020-03-17 17:51:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
The QFC I go to just cut its hours (it was open 24/7 except for the
usual holidays). I don't tour the whole thing, and the bits I do
mostly don't look any different. Except the canned fruit. Peaches are
cleared out, pears nearly so. The canned veggies are about normal.

So far, so good. But it's early days yet.
--
"I begin to envy Petronius."
"I have envied him long since."
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-17 19:56:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
The QFC I go to just cut its hours (it was open 24/7 except for the
usual holidays). I don't tour the whole thing, and the bits I do
mostly don't look any different. Except the canned fruit. Peaches are
cleared out, pears nearly so. The canned veggies are about normal.
So far, so good. But it's early days yet.
News from the left coast: Costco is limiting the number of
shoppers that can be in the store at a time. (And high time, I
say, considering how packed it was yesterday.)

And some stores are opening an hour earlier, but only admitting
those 65 or over during that hour.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Lynn McGuire
2020-03-17 21:30:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
The QFC I go to just cut its hours (it was open 24/7 except for the
usual holidays). I don't tour the whole thing, and the bits I do
mostly don't look any different. Except the canned fruit. Peaches are
cleared out, pears nearly so. The canned veggies are about normal.
So far, so good. But it's early days yet.
News from the left coast: Costco is limiting the number of
shoppers that can be in the store at a time. (And high time, I
say, considering how packed it was yesterday.)
And some stores are opening an hour earlier, but only admitting
those 65 or over during that hour.
Thus prompting the fake id people to starting selling 65 year old
driver's licenses to 35 year olds.

Lynn
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-17 21:55:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Lynn McGuire
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
The QFC I go to just cut its hours (it was open 24/7 except for the
usual holidays). I don't tour the whole thing, and the bits I do
mostly don't look any different. Except the canned fruit. Peaches are
cleared out, pears nearly so. The canned veggies are about normal.
So far, so good. But it's early days yet.
News from the left coast: Costco is limiting the number of
shoppers that can be in the store at a time. (And high time, I
say, considering how packed it was yesterday.)
And some stores are opening an hour earlier, but only admitting
those 65 or over during that hour.
Thus prompting the fake id people to starting selling 65 year old
driver's licenses to 35 year olds.
/snork

I have looked younger than I am all my life. (Was a real
handicap when I was in my twenties and looked like mid-teens.
Not that I wanted either to drink or to gamble, but there were
places where I couldn't go.)

I probably don't look 65 *yet.*
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
J. Clarke
2020-03-17 21:42:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
The QFC I go to just cut its hours (it was open 24/7 except for the
usual holidays). I don't tour the whole thing, and the bits I do
mostly don't look any different. Except the canned fruit. Peaches are
cleared out, pears nearly so. The canned veggies are about normal.
So far, so good. But it's early days yet.
News from the left coast: Costco is limiting the number of
shoppers that can be in the store at a time. (And high time, I
say, considering how packed it was yesterday.)
And some stores are opening an hour earlier, but only admitting
those 65 or over during that hour.
Last night Stop&Shop closed at 8 (usually at 11). ShopRite was open
at 9:30 PM but they had little milk (I had to settle for LactAid which
seemed to be in plentiful supply), bread (I get to try a new brand),
large jars of peanut butter, jelly, canned soup, canned chili, and
packaged macaroni and cheese. In general everything was pretty well
picked over.

I got everything I was looking for, although not always the exact
product I wanted (different brand, package size, etc). Next time I'll
try the delivery service.
Robert Carnegie
2020-03-17 22:10:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
The QFC I go to just cut its hours (it was open 24/7 except for the
usual holidays). I don't tour the whole thing, and the bits I do
mostly don't look any different. Except the canned fruit. Peaches are
cleared out, pears nearly so. The canned veggies are about normal.
So far, so good. But it's early days yet.
News from the left coast: Costco is limiting the number of
shoppers that can be in the store at a time. (And high time, I
say, considering how packed it was yesterday.)
And some stores are opening an hour earlier, but only admitting
those 65 or over during that hour.
Last night Stop&Shop closed at 8 (usually at 11). ShopRite was open
at 9:30 PM but they had little milk (I had to settle for LactAid which
seemed to be in plentiful supply), bread (I get to try a new brand),
large jars of peanut butter, jelly, canned soup, canned chili, and
packaged macaroni and cheese. In general everything was pretty well
picked over.
I got everything I was looking for, although not always the exact
product I wanted (different brand, package size, etc). Next time I'll
try the delivery service.
I predict that you'll be surprised how quickly
you are served. In present circumstances.

Well, now you won't be surprised, maybe. That your
Easter egg arrives hatched and fledged.

I think some smart person on BBC radio the other day
was explaining that production can easily adjust to
the current demand, and this adjustment will be producing far fewer varieties of the same product. For one thing,
a production line can pump out more of variety A alone
than if they keep having to stop and switch between
variety A and variety B.
J. Clarke
2020-03-18 00:14:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tue, 17 Mar 2020 15:10:20 -0700 (PDT), Robert Carnegie
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
The QFC I go to just cut its hours (it was open 24/7 except for the
usual holidays). I don't tour the whole thing, and the bits I do
mostly don't look any different. Except the canned fruit. Peaches are
cleared out, pears nearly so. The canned veggies are about normal.
So far, so good. But it's early days yet.
News from the left coast: Costco is limiting the number of
shoppers that can be in the store at a time. (And high time, I
say, considering how packed it was yesterday.)
And some stores are opening an hour earlier, but only admitting
those 65 or over during that hour.
Last night Stop&Shop closed at 8 (usually at 11). ShopRite was open
at 9:30 PM but they had little milk (I had to settle for LactAid which
seemed to be in plentiful supply), bread (I get to try a new brand),
large jars of peanut butter, jelly, canned soup, canned chili, and
packaged macaroni and cheese. In general everything was pretty well
picked over.
I got everything I was looking for, although not always the exact
product I wanted (different brand, package size, etc). Next time I'll
try the delivery service.
I predict that you'll be surprised how quickly
you are served. In present circumstances.
Well, now you won't be surprised, maybe. That your
Easter egg arrives hatched and fledged.
I think some smart person on BBC radio the other day
was explaining that production can easily adjust to
the current demand, and this adjustment will be producing far fewer varieties of the same product. For one thing,
a production line can pump out more of variety A alone
than if they keep having to stop and switch between
variety A and variety B.
Production doesn't have to adjust to demand. There isn't anything
about a disease that increases demand for food. People are just
panic-stricken and are stockpiling.
Dorothy J Heydt
2020-03-18 00:37:51 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Robert Carnegie
I think some smart person on BBC radio the other day
was explaining that production can easily adjust to
the current demand, and this adjustment will be producing far fewer
varieties of the same product. For one thing,
a production line can pump out more of variety A alone
than if they keep having to stop and switch between
variety A and variety B.
Sounds reasonable. I wonder what sorts of A and B we use in this
household whereof one will go missing in a few weeks/months.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Robert Carnegie
2020-03-21 11:20:49 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Robert Carnegie
Post by J. Clarke
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Paul S Person
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Lynn McGuire
Over The Hedge: disrupting the global Twinkie supply chain
https://www.gocomics.com/overthehedge/2020/03/16
Nooooooooooo !!!!!!
We just got back from Costco. It looked like World War II, with
people frantically buying up everything they could before
rationing sets in. There was a sign up in front, "We are out
of..." toilet paper, fresh chicken, fresh ground beef [those were
both available frozen], eggs, rice, beans, and some other stuff.
Milk was also listed, but in fact they had a couple of pallets
thereof; must have just gotten in a delivery.
I expect rationing to go in within a few weeks. Could get
interesing.
It also reminds me of Willis's _Doomsday Book_, in which Finch
comes in every five or six pages to report, "We're out of
[noun]."
The QFC I go to just cut its hours (it was open 24/7 except for the
usual holidays). I don't tour the whole thing, and the bits I do
mostly don't look any different. Except the canned fruit. Peaches are
cleared out, pears nearly so. The canned veggies are about normal.
So far, so good. But it's early days yet.
News from the left coast: Costco is limiting the number of
shoppers that can be in the store at a time. (And high time, I
say, considering how packed it was yesterday.)
And some stores are opening an hour earlier, but only admitting
those 65 or over during that hour.
Last night Stop&Shop closed at 8 (usually at 11). ShopRite was open
at 9:30 PM but they had little milk (I had to settle for LactAid which
seemed to be in plentiful supply), bread (I get to try a new brand),
large jars of peanut butter, jelly, canned soup, canned chili, and
packaged macaroni and cheese. In general everything was pretty well
picked over.
I got everything I was looking for, although not always the exact
product I wanted (different brand, package size, etc). Next time I'll
try the delivery service.
I predict that you'll be surprised how quickly
you are served. In present circumstances.
Well, now you won't be surprised, maybe. That your
Easter egg arrives hatched and fledged.
I think some smart person on BBC radio the other day
was explaining that production can easily adjust to
the current demand, and this adjustment will be
producing far fewer varieties of the same product.
For one thing, a production line can pump out more
of variety A alone than if they keep having to stop
and switch between variety A and variety B.
<https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-51961624>
says this again - since repetition of information
is in style this week.
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