Discussion:
The Adventure of the Mis-Placed Modifier
(too old to reply)
p***@hotmail.com
2019-08-08 21:12:37 UTC
Permalink
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.

"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"

The fourth to the last paragraph has a sentence that seems jarring:

Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.

I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?

Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?

Peter Wezeman
anti-social Darwinist
Moriarty
2019-08-08 21:51:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.
"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"
Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.
I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor books once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my parents, Ayn Rand and God" in it.

I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.

-Moriarty
Peter Trei
2019-08-08 23:35:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Moriarty
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.
"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"
Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.
I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor books once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my parents, Ayn Rand and God" in it.
I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.
Oh, for an Oxford comma....

Pt
Dorothy J Heydt
2019-08-08 23:49:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Moriarty
Post by Moriarty
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.
"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"
Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.
I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor
books once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my
parents, Ayn Rand and God" in it.
Post by Moriarty
I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.
Oh, for an Oxford comma....
Clearly the author was not educated at Oxford.

(Neither was I, but I know how to use the comma.)
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
p***@hotmail.com
2019-08-08 23:38:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Moriarty
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.
"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"
Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.
I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor books once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my parents, Ayn Rand and God" in it.
I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.
With a pedigree like that, how could you go wrong?

Peter Wezeman
anti-social Darwinist
Kevrob
2019-08-09 01:11:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by Moriarty
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.
"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"
Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.
I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor books once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my parents, Ayn Rand and God" in it.
I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.
With a pedigree like that, how could you go wrong?
I've heard of families where Mom acts as if dad doesn't exist...

or...

Frank O'Connor was ghod? (or Nathaniel Brandon was?)

Kevin R
Dorothy J Heydt
2019-08-09 02:01:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Moriarty
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by Moriarty
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.
"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"
Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.
I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor
books once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my
parents, Ayn Rand and God" in it.
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by Moriarty
I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.
With a pedigree like that, how could you go wrong?
I've heard of families where Mom acts as if dad doesn't exist...
or...
Frank O'Connor was ghod? (or Nathaniel Brandon was?)
I had to google both those gentlemen and I still don't see the
connection. Elucidate, please?
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Kevrob
2019-08-09 03:01:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Frank O'Connor was ghod? (or Nathaniel Brandon was?)
I had to google both those gentlemen and I still don't see the
connection. Elucidate, please?
Sorry, I misspelled Branden's last name.

O'Connor was La Popessa's husband.
Branden was her protege and, as the kids today say,
"side piece."

https://preview.tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit

which is...

https://tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit

resolving to:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/nathaniel-branden-lover-and-disciple-of-novelist-ayn-rand-dies-at-84/2014/12/09/f1458d7e-7fca-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.html?noredirect=on

Kevin R
Dorothy J Heydt
2019-08-09 03:54:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Frank O'Connor was ghod? (or Nathaniel Brandon was?)
I had to google both those gentlemen and I still don't see the
connection. Elucidate, please?
Sorry, I misspelled Branden's last name.
O'Connor was La Popessa's husband.
/googles La Popessa

She was a nun? She had a husband???? Do they mean Pius XII?
Evidently not, if you're talking about O'Connor.
Post by Kevrob
Branden was her protege and, as the kids today say,
"side piece."
https://preview.tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
which is...
https://tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/nathaniel-branden-lover-and-disciple-of-novelist-ayn-rand-dies-at-84/2014/12/09/f1458d7e-7fca-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.html?noredirect=on
Okay, whose side piece was he, La Popessa's or Ayn Rand's?

In the immortal words of Spielberg, who ARE these people?

(and why should i care....)
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Moriarty
2019-08-09 04:29:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Frank O'Connor was ghod? (or Nathaniel Brandon was?)
I had to google both those gentlemen and I still don't see the
connection. Elucidate, please?
Sorry, I misspelled Branden's last name.
O'Connor was La Popessa's husband.
/googles La Popessa
She was a nun? She had a husband???? Do they mean Pius XII?
Evidently not, if you're talking about O'Connor.
Post by Kevrob
Branden was her protege and, as the kids today say,
"side piece."
https://preview.tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
which is...
https://tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/nathaniel-branden-lover-and-disciple-of-novelist-ayn-rand-dies-at-84/2014/12/09/f1458d7e-7fca-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.html?noredirect=on
Okay, whose side piece was he, La Popessa's or Ayn Rand's?
In the immortal words of Spielberg, who ARE these people?
La Popessa IS Ayn Rand. I think La Prophetine would be more appropriate but La Popessa gave me a chuckle.
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
(and why should i care....)
You probably shouldn't.

-Moriarty
Kevrob
2019-08-09 05:04:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Moriarty
La Popessa IS Ayn Rand. I think La Prophetine would be more appropriate but La Popessa gave me a chuckle.
Yes. Those of us who either went through an Objectivist Phase or
were close to doing so have sometimes referred to Alisa Rosenbaum as
"the Pope of Objectivism," or sometimes "the Pope-ess."

The first time I heard that crack, it reminded me of Pius XII's
de facto private secretary:

https://www.kirkusreviews.com/book-reviews/paul-i-with-r-rene-arlington-murphy/la-popessa/

There's also the legend of Pope Joan.

The Objectivist inner circle was not entirely humorless.
The members, all staunch anti-communists, referred to themselves
as "the Collective."* "Cabal" might have been more apt but TINC.

Rand would "excommunicate" people from her movement. Branden wasn't
the only one to be "cast out."

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectivist_movement#The_Collective

Kevin R
Peter Trei
2019-08-09 04:33:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Frank O'Connor was ghod? (or Nathaniel Brandon was?)
I had to google both those gentlemen and I still don't see the
connection. Elucidate, please?
Sorry, I misspelled Branden's last name.
O'Connor was La Popessa's husband.
/googles La Popessa
She was a nun? She had a husband???? Do they mean Pius XII?
Evidently not, if you're talking about O'Connor.
Post by Kevrob
Branden was her protege and, as the kids today say,
"side piece."
https://preview.tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
which is...
https://tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/nathaniel-branden-lover-and-disciple-of-novelist-ayn-rand-dies-at-84/2014/12/09/f1458d7e-7fca-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.html?noredirect=on
Okay, whose side piece was he, La Popessa's or Ayn Rand's?
In the immortal words of Spielberg, who ARE these people?
(and why should i care....)
You probably should not care.

O'Connor was Ayn Rands legal husband. Brandon was her paramour.

Ayn Rand was the author of 'The Fountainhead', and ‘Atlas's Shrugged‘

Pt
Dorothy J Heydt
2019-08-09 06:18:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Trei
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Frank O'Connor was ghod? (or Nathaniel Brandon was?)
I had to google both those gentlemen and I still don't see the
connection. Elucidate, please?
Sorry, I misspelled Branden's last name.
O'Connor was La Popessa's husband.
/googles La Popessa
She was a nun? She had a husband???? Do they mean Pius XII?
Evidently not, if you're talking about O'Connor.
Post by Kevrob
Branden was her protege and, as the kids today say,
"side piece."
https://preview.tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
which is...
https://tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/nathaniel-branden-lover-and-disciple-of-novelist-ayn-rand-dies-at-84/2014/12/09/f1458d7e-7fca-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.html?noredirect=on
Okay, whose side piece was he, La Popessa's or Ayn Rand's?
In the immortal words of Spielberg, who ARE these people?
(and why should i care....)
You probably should not care.
O'Connor was Ayn Rands legal husband. Brandon was her paramour.
Ayn Rand was the author of 'The Fountainhead', and ‘Atlas's Shrugged‘
Okay. So what does either of them, or Rand herself for that
matter, have to do with Pius XII's secretary?
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Peter Trei
2019-08-09 22:08:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Peter Trei
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Post by Kevrob
Frank O'Connor was ghod? (or Nathaniel Brandon was?)
I had to google both those gentlemen and I still don't see the
connection. Elucidate, please?
Sorry, I misspelled Branden's last name.
O'Connor was La Popessa's husband.
/googles La Popessa
She was a nun? She had a husband???? Do they mean Pius XII?
Evidently not, if you're talking about O'Connor.
Post by Kevrob
Branden was her protege and, as the kids today say,
"side piece."
https://preview.tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
which is...
https://tinyurl.com/Branden-WaPo-Obit
https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/books/nathaniel-branden-lover-and-disciple-of-novelist-ayn-rand-dies-at-84/2014/12/09/f1458d7e-7fca-11e4-81fd-8c4814dfa9d7_story.html?noredirect=on
Okay, whose side piece was he, La Popessa's or Ayn Rand's?
In the immortal words of Spielberg, who ARE these people?
(and why should i care....)
You probably should not care.
O'Connor was Ayn Rands legal husband. Brandon was her paramour.
Ayn Rand was the author of 'The Fountainhead', and ‘Atlas's Shrugged‘
Okay. So what does either of them, or Rand herself for that
matter, have to do with Pius XII's secretary?
Nothing but the similarity of 'Popess' and 'Popessa'.

Pt
Quadibloc
2019-08-10 14:40:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
Okay, whose side piece was he, La Popessa's or Ayn Rand's?
Nathaniel Branden I've heard of. He was continuing on the work of Ayn Rand after
her death. So I'll assume he was hers, I do remember reading of a relationship
beteween the two, but I was not aware that she was also married.

John Savard
Titus G
2019-08-09 03:57:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Post by Moriarty
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.
"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"
Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.
I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor books once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my parents, Ayn Rand and God" in it.
I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.
With a pedigree like that, how could you go wrong?
Peter Wezeman
anti-social Darwinist
Unlike the good old days, nobody is believed when reporting
conversations with God so this must be another indication of Rand's
grasp on reality.

"Why have I never seen him. Where's my Dad?".
"Everywhere dear."
Quadibloc
2019-08-10 14:42:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Titus G
Unlike the good old days, nobody is believed when reporting
conversations with God
And think of how much misery that would have saved had it been true earlier.

That chap Muhammad would never even have got started.

John Savard
Juho Julkunen
2019-08-11 12:47:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
Unlike the good old days, nobody is believed when reporting
conversations with God
And think of how much misery that would have saved had it been true earlier.
That chap Muhammad would never even have got started.
John Savard
Or those earlier chaps, nipping the whole thing in the bud.
--
Juho Julkunen
J. Clarke
2019-08-11 16:30:25 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 11 Aug 2019 15:47:38 +0300, Juho Julkunen
Post by Juho Julkunen
Post by Quadibloc
Post by Titus G
Unlike the good old days, nobody is believed when reporting
conversations with God
And think of how much misery that would have saved had it been true earlier.
That chap Muhammad would never even have got started.
John Savard
Or those earlier chaps, nipping the whole thing in the bud.
This would be a large-scale long term effort. If religion had been
stamped out until the 20th century you'd need to get Steve Jobs, Linus
Torvalds, and Elon Musk among others--if you don't think that they
started religions you aren't paying attention.

David Goldfarb
2019-08-09 00:51:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Moriarty
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor books
once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my parents, Ayn
Rand and God" in it.
I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.
Teresa has quoted this dedication more than once, but I feel quite
certain that it wasn't on a manuscript. Nobody knows where that sentence
actually came from.

A real example along the same lines has the advantage of having an
actual provenance: to wit, the _Times_ of London, describing a
documentary about Peter Ustinov's travels:

"Highlights of his global tour include encounters with Nelson Mandela,
an 800-year-old demigod and a dildo collector."
--
David Goldfarb |"Come on, characters with super-strength don't
***@gmail.com | *do* inertia! Or leverage."
***@ocf.berkeley.edu | -- Dani Zweig
Moriarty
2019-08-09 01:20:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Goldfarb
Post by Moriarty
It's not quite what you're after but Teresa Nielsen Hayden of Tor books
once received a manuscript with "I dedicate this book to my parents, Ayn
Rand and God" in it.
I wonder if she published it? Or even kept reading.
Teresa has quoted this dedication more than once, but I feel quite
certain that it wasn't on a manuscript. Nobody knows where that sentence
actually came from.
Yes, google and snopes agree with you: it probably is apocryphal. Pity.
Post by David Goldfarb
A real example along the same lines has the advantage of having an
actual provenance: to wit, the _Times_ of London, describing a
"Highlights of his global tour include encounters with Nelson Mandela,
an 800-year-old demigod and a dildo collector."
Mandela was certainly many faceted! (Possibly many fauceted too.)

-Moriarty
Robert Carnegie
2019-08-09 00:31:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Positron emission tomography scans can now detect amyloid plaques in the
brain. Such plaques are associated with Alzeimer's disease. Paula Span's
column in the August 6 _New York Times_ science section discusses the cost
and value of the scan.
"Even if a scan cost zero dollars, I wouldn't recommend it," said
Dr. Ken Covinsky, a geriatrician at the University of California,
San Francisco. "Do you really want to know that you have amyloid in
your brain, years before cognitive problems that may never develop?"
Proponents of making PET scans widely available argue that knowing
their amyloid status may motivate patients to make lifestyle changes.
Stopping smoking, exercising and eating more healthily are all found
to reduce dementia, even among those at higher genetic risk.
I would have phrased that "Exercising, eating more healthily, and
stopping smoking are all found to reduce dementia." In this case
there is no real confusion since no one would possibly recommend
stopping exercising. Is there any generally accepted rule about
the use of modifiers that could possibly apply to more than one
subsequent term?
Only in computer programming.
NOT SMOKING AND EXERCISING AND EATING_RIGHT

But I'd say that a second modifier cancels the effect:

Quitting smoking, quitting drinking, exercising,
and eating right - clearly this is about stopping
the things that have the word "stopping" next to them.

Stopping smoking, but exercising, and eating more healthily -
this separates the first item from the others, avoiding
what I remind myself is called syllepsis. There's one
threatened at the end, as well. More at
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Have_Some_Madeira_M%27Dear>
a "hilarious song about date rape".

...and eating more isn't recommended, either.
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
Instructions for computer programming...
Ahasuerus
2019-08-09 21:22:09 UTC
Permalink
On Thursday, August 8, 2019 at 5:12:39 PM UTC-4, ***@hotmail.com
wrote:
[snip-snip]
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
I have been reading fan fiction lately (I blame Dave DeLaney, who
recommended _Worm_ and Worm fan fiction a few years ago.)

My answer to your question is "Oh, dear God..."
David DeLaney
2019-08-10 00:24:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ahasuerus
[snip-snip]
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
I have been reading fan fiction lately (I blame Dave DeLaney, who
recommended _Worm_ and Worm fan fiction a few years ago.)
If it helps any, just about ALL Worm fanfics are a good deal less dark than the
original. (By necessity.)

Currently keeping track of Taylor Varga and Mauling Snarks, plus a fairly new
effort by MS' author that's a Nanoha crossover, Hybrid Hive Eat Shard? .

It ... does get its hooks into one.
Post by Ahasuerus
My answer to your question is "Oh, dear God..."
Dave, Lovecraft had no CLUE just how horridly twisted & florid prose could get
--
\/David DeLaney posting thru EarthLink - "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
my gatekeeper archives are no longer accessible :( / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Dorothy J Heydt
2019-08-10 02:17:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Ahasuerus
[snip-snip]
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
I have been reading fan fiction lately (I blame Dave DeLaney, who
recommended _Worm_ and Worm fan fiction a few years ago.)
If it helps any, just about ALL Worm fanfics are a good deal less dark than the
original. (By necessity.)
Currently keeping track of Taylor Varga and Mauling Snarks, plus a fairly new
effort by MS' author that's a Nanoha crossover, Hybrid Hive Eat Shard? .
It ... does get its hooks into one.
Post by Ahasuerus
My answer to your question is "Oh, dear God..."
I had to google about a screenful and a half on "Worm fanfic"
before I got something telling me what the original Worm was.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
David DeLaney
2019-08-10 10:15:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
I had to google about a screenful and a half on "Worm fanfic"
before I got something telling me what the original Worm was.
Lucky you - this means you've blanked out on us telling you what it was from
last time around.

Dave, technical answer: it's a very long webserial about supervillainy in an
extremely grimdark world
--
\/David DeLaney posting thru EarthLink - "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
my gatekeeper archives are no longer accessible :( / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.
Dorothy J Heydt
2019-08-10 14:57:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
I had to google about a screenful and a half on "Worm fanfic"
before I got something telling me what the original Worm was.
Lucky you - this means you've blanked out on us telling you what it was from
last time around.
I sure have.
Post by David DeLaney
Dave, technical answer: it's a very long webserial about supervillainy in an
extremely grimdark world
So I gathered. Not my thing at all.
--
Dorothy J. Heydt
Vallejo, California
djheydt at gmail dot com
www.kithrup.com/~djheydt/
Magewolf
2019-08-10 16:00:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
I had to google about a screenful and a half on "Worm fanfic"
before I got something telling me what the original Worm was.
Lucky you - this means you've blanked out on us telling you what it was from
last time around.
Dave, technical answer: it's a very long webserial about supervillainy in an
extremely grimdark world
So it is not about the games. I was wondering how you would make fanfic
of the old computer games.
Juho Julkunen
2019-08-11 12:51:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Magewolf
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
I had to google about a screenful and a half on "Worm fanfic"
before I got something telling me what the original Worm was.
Lucky you - this means you've blanked out on us telling you what it was from
last time around.
Dave, technical answer: it's a very long webserial about supervillainy in an
extremely grimdark world
So it is not about the games. I was wondering how you would make fanfic
of the old computer games.
Are you a bad enough dude to find out?

https://www.fanfiction.net/game/Worms/
--
Juho Julkunen
Magewolf
2019-08-11 14:28:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Juho Julkunen
Post by Magewolf
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
I had to google about a screenful and a half on "Worm fanfic"
before I got something telling me what the original Worm was.
Lucky you - this means you've blanked out on us telling you what it was from
last time around.
Dave, technical answer: it's a very long webserial about supervillainy in an
extremely grimdark world
So it is not about the games. I was wondering how you would make fanfic
of the old computer games.
Are you a bad enough dude to find out?
https://www.fanfiction.net/game/Worms/
Well, that shows me.
Ahasuerus
2019-08-10 16:59:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
I had to google about a screenful and a half on "Worm fanfic"
before I got something telling me what the original Worm was.
Lucky you - this means you've blanked out on us telling you what it
was from last time around.
Dave, technical answer: it's a very long webserial about
supervillainy in an extremely grimdark world
To quote what I wrote on the "rational" subreddit a couple of days
ago:

"_Worm_ tackles many different issues. One of them is at least
rational-adjacent: how do you create a universe with standard
superhero conventions -- which were originally developed for children
-- and make them work for an older audience? After all, secret
identities, masks and costumes, non-lethal confrontations, "deranged
supervillains", mad scientists and other elements common in classic
superhero comics are not something that you would expect to arise
even if some humans suddenly obtained superpowers in real life. _Worm_
goes out of its way to create a universe where comics conventions sort
of make sense."
Gene Wirchenko
2019-08-11 03:59:48 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 05:15:34 -0500, David DeLaney
Post by David DeLaney
Post by Dorothy J Heydt
I had to google about a screenful and a half on "Worm fanfic"
before I got something telling me what the original Worm was.
Lucky you - this means you've blanked out on us telling you what it was from
last time around.
Dave, technical answer: it's a very long webserial about supervillainy in an
extremely grimdark world
Extremely. I had to give up on it. It was too exhausting.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko
Ahasuerus
2019-08-10 16:55:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by David DeLaney
[snip]
I have been reading fan fiction lately (I blame Dave DeLaney, who
recommended _Worm_ and Worm fan fiction a few years ago.)
If it helps any, just about ALL Worm fanfics are a good deal less
dark than the original. (By necessity.)
Granted, a lot of them are "fix-fics", "curb stomps", "crack"
[absurdist] humor, stories of redemption or just "slice of life".
However, "about ALL" may be overstating it a bit. I have only read
30ish Worm fanfics (out of the 7,000+ out there), but I have already
come across at least one that was as dark as Worm: "From High Above".
(On the other wing, the fic was abandoned half-way through the second
arc. It may have become a story of redemption if it had been completed.)

Also, there are different types of "dark". _Worm_'s universe and its
characters start out dark, but the darkness is exacerbated by its
relentless pace, pervasive paranoia and a suffocating atmosphere.
It's a difficult combination to recreate, so even when a fanfic
author tries to do "dark", the resulting darkness may not be as
oppressive as the canon's.

Finally, different people react differently to different types of
darkness. For example, I can handle things like torture and rape
just fine, but I find "mind break" quite unpleasant. It was a bit
of a shock when I came across it in _Time Braid_, an otherwise
upbeat _Naruto_ fanfic. In retrospect, I should have probably
expected something like that since "Peggy Sue" plots make it
difficult to create meaningful challenges without messing with
the characters' minds.
Post by David DeLaney
Currently keeping track of Taylor Varga and Mauling Snarks
Now that I have read _Worm_ and watched _Luna Varga_ (which wasn't
as bad as I had feared considering the medium and the era), I am well
positioned to tackle _Taylor Varga_. I am a bit hesitant to start
given its size (to quote the author, it "grew rather out of hand,
although I regret nothing!") and how polarizing it is, but I may give
it a shot at some point.

_Mauling Snarks_ is also polarizing and the synopsis is not too
appealing, so I am not sure I'll ever get to it.
Post by David DeLaney
plus a fairly new effort by MS' author that's a Nanoha crossover,
Hybrid Hive Eat Shard? .
Apparently Nanoha crossovers are quite popular. I can see why since
the first two seasons of the _Nanoha_ anime were pretty good at
what they were trying to do. And what better way to fix broken
people than with weaponized power of friendship? Clearly nothing
can possibly go wrong.

BTW, the author of _Taylor Varga_ recently started another serial,
_For the Honor of the Regiment_, which, unsurprisingly, is a Bolo
crossover.
Post by David DeLaney
It ... does get its hooks into one.
Apparently quite a few people find the "ongoing serial" format
appealing. Newspaper serializations have a long history going
back to at least Eugene Sue's extremely popular _The Wandering Jew_,
which was serialized in the early 1840s.

Personally, I am not a big fan of the format (starting _Mother of
Learning_ before it was completed was a mistake), but then I don't
typically follow ongoing TV series either. Streaming has been an
amazing boon for us "bingers" (no, not in that sense!).
Gene Wirchenko
2019-08-10 23:49:43 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 8 Aug 2019 14:12:37 -0700 (PDT), ***@hotmail.com
wrote:

[snip]
Post by p***@hotmail.com
Has anyone encountered a similar situation where they had doubt
about just what words a modifier was intended to apply to?
Yes, and I wish I had saved it. I used to do peer English
tutoring. Some Chinese students really messed up their modifiers and
pronouns. In one case, there were two possibilities, and in both
cases, the sentence was still hash.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko
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