Why on earth

Post by James Nicoll
Has a page fallen out of this mass market paperback, which I just purchased
in 1978?

Surely we need more details.

--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

James Nicoll

2024-02-10 17:05:00 UTC

Post by James Nicoll
Has a page fallen out of this mass market paperback, which I just purchased
in 1978?

Surely we need more details.

Wait eight days :)

Robert Woodward

2024-02-10 17:56:22 UTC

Post by James Nicoll
Has a page fallen out of this mass market paperback, which I just purchased
in 1978?

I have quite a few mass market paperbacks that I bought in 1978 (my book
list includes 178 that were published that year). If I have a title (and
publisher), I could check to see if I have a copy and check it for the
page in question.

--
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_.
-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward ***@drizzle.com

Scott Dorsey

2024-02-10 18:51:54 UTC

Post by James Nicoll
Has a page fallen out of this mass market paperback, which I just purchased
in 1978?

Perhaps if you have some paperbacks whose pages have fallen out and Mr. Nicoll
has some paperbacks whose pages have fallen out you could get together and mix
and match to create some more complete paperbacks?
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Robert Carnegie

2024-02-11 12:01:45 UTC

Post by James Nicoll
Has a page fallen out of this mass market paperback, which I just purchased
in 1978?

It's necessary to establish whether pages
are missing.

It's also necessary to establish whether
pages are numbered.

If a page falls out when you open the book,
you have a fair chance of putting the page
back, quite close to where it came from.
If it is just not there, perhaps it never
was there.

I think I've been hit a couple of times
by a "signature", a binary bunch of pages
(16 or 32 or so), not strictly being
missing, but being the wrong pages.
But the right amount, usually. So you
get pages 1-16, say, then 33-48,
then 33-48 again. In Roger Zelazny's
_Today We Choose Faces_, the text was
opaque enough that I didn't notice
something was wrong with my book until
it started repeating. Once I got a
correct copy, it was not much more
intelligible.

Scott Dorsey

2024-02-11 14:48:00 UTC

Post by Robert Carnegie
I think I've been hit a couple of times
by a "signature", a binary bunch of pages
(16 or 32 or so), not strictly being
missing, but being the wrong pages.
But the right amount, usually. So you
get pages 1-16, say, then 33-48,
then 33-48 again. In Roger Zelazny's
_Today We Choose Faces_, the text was
opaque enough that I didn't notice
something was wrong with my book until
it started repeating. Once I got a
correct copy, it was not much more
intelligible.

The first time I read Dhalgren I thought this had happened and I
carefully went and checked all the pages. Then I reread it a second
time. On the third reading I figured out what was going on, though.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

BCFD 36

2024-02-11 19:52:57 UTC

Try as I might, I could not finish Dahlgren. I actually didn't all that
far into it. It rode in the back window of my old Toyota Corolla for years.

--
----------------
Dave Scruggs
Senior Software Engineer - Lockheed Martin, et. al (mostly Retired)
Captain - Boulder Creek Fire (Retired)

2024-02-11 21:40:51 UTC

Try as I might, I could not finish Dahlgren. I actually didn't all that far
into it. It rode in the back window of my old Toyota Corolla for years.

Thank you for sharing. I was also not able to get through Dhalgren.

Best regards,
Daniel

WolfFan

2024-02-11 22:25:50 UTC

Try as I might, I could not finish Dahlgren. I actually didn't all that far
into it. It rode in the back window of my old Toyota Corolla for years.

Thank you for sharing. I was also not able to get through Dhalgren.
Best regards,
Daniel

Dhalgren is one of those books like Joyce’s Ulysses or Pynchon’s
Gravity’s Rainbow which many have tried but few have actually read. I got
all the way to the shit-eating while travelling down the Rhine on a barge
scene in Rainbow before bouncing it off a wall. (You think that I’m joking?
Get a copy. It’s about two thirds of the way in, and is described in
glowing, loving, detail. Off the wall and into the trash you go.) My memories
of Ulysses is dimmer, mostly because it was such an excellent sleep aide.
Dhalgren was much better. I still never finished it.

2024-02-12 09:09:24 UTC

Try as I might, I could not finish Dahlgren. I actually didn't all that far
into it. It rode in the back window of my old Toyota Corolla for years.

Thank you for sharing. I was also not able to get through Dhalgren.
Best regards,
Daniel

Dhalgren is one of those books like Joyceâs Ulysses or Pynchonâs
Gravityâs Rainbow which many have tried but few have actually read. I got
all the way to the shit-eating while travelling down the Rhine on a barge
scene in Rainbow before bouncing it off a wall. (You think that Iâm joking?
Get a copy. Itâs about two thirds of the way in, and is described in
glowing, loving, detail. Off the wall and into the trash you go.) My memories
of Ulysses is dimmer, mostly because it was such an excellent sleep aide.
Dhalgren was much better. I still never finished it.

I find these types of books very fascinating! Can you learn to like them?
Is the reason that you and I did not finish them, that we have not yet
achieved the pinnacle of aesthetic development? Will we pick up the book
in 10 years and love it?

Scott Dorsey

2024-02-12 09:41:53 UTC

I find these types of books very fascinating! Can you learn to like them?=
Is the reason that you and I did not finish them, that we have not yet=20
achieved the pinnacle of aesthetic development? Will we pick up the book=20
in 10 years and love it?

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.

My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Lynn McGuire

2024-02-13 02:23:58 UTC

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is
enough. But I loved The Hobbit.

Lynn

David Duffy

2024-02-13 05:10:53 UTC

Post by Scott Dorsey
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I had that doubling experience of reading Patrick White's _Voss_, which
is the Nobel prize winning realist novel about a 19th century explorer
who just happens to a develop a telepathic link to his love. The first time
was impenetrable, the second (a year later) was so easy, and "this is
actually kind of SFnal". In the music sphere, I can still remember
the sensation of how jangly and horrible the Beatles were on first
hearing as a kid.

Post by Lynn McGuire
I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is
enough. But I loved The Hobbit.

As I've previously commented in this context, I first read LotR starting in
volume 2 (Book 3, isn't it?) - the perfect place before continual action.
Then any longeurs in volume 1's become a peaceful lead up. However, I think
when I said this last time, you (Lynn) had tried that without any luck.

Cheers, David.

2024-02-13 09:12:10 UTC

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is enough.
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

Paul S Person

2024-02-13 16:18:04 UTC

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is enough.
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

Robert Woodward

2024-02-13 17:54:58 UTC

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is enough.
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

Paul S Person

2024-02-14 17:10:55 UTC

On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is enough.
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

It does have an /awful/ lot of exposition.

--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

Paul S Person

2024-02-14 17:13:35 UTC

On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is enough.
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

<oops! forgot to add this -- lots of exposition.>

<a lot of exposition.> Which is probably why, the movie, it is the
Shouting Match of Elrond, which is degenerating into the Bar Brawl of
Elrond when Frodo speaks up.

--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

Dimensional Traveler

2024-02-14 18:07:29 UTC

Post by Paul S Person
On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is enough.
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

<oops! forgot to add this -- lots of exposition.>
<a lot of exposition.> Which is probably why, the movie, it is the
Shouting Match of Elrond, which is degenerating into the Bar Brawl of
Elrond when Frodo speaks up.

I never had any problem reading LoTR in my teens. I read the entire
Baum OZ series as a child too along with a significant number of other
books. I had access my mother's entire childhood library and _her_
mother's childhood library and read a lot.

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

Ted Nolan <tednolan>

2024-02-14 18:27:09 UTC

Post by Paul S Person
On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is enough.
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

<oops! forgot to add this -- lots of exposition.>
<a lot of exposition.> Which is probably why, the movie, it is the
Shouting Match of Elrond, which is degenerating into the Bar Brawl of
Elrond when Frodo speaks up.

Now "OZ" I bounced off of many times. Finally forced myself to finish
it a few years ago, but man it was a slog.

--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

Dimensional Traveler

2024-02-14 19:42:10 UTC

Post by Paul S Person
On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times and think
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative actually worked.
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to read Dune
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad school and
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried reading it
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces is enough.
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

<oops! forgot to add this -- lots of exposition.>
<a lot of exposition.> Which is probably why, the movie, it is the
Shouting Match of Elrond, which is degenerating into the Bar Brawl of
Elrond when Frodo speaks up.

Now "OZ" I bounced off of many times. Finally forced myself to finish
it a few years ago, but man it was a slog.

Do you remember why it was such a slog for you?

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

Ted Nolan <tednolan>

2024-02-14 21:23:01 UTC

Post by Paul S Person
On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

Post by D
I find these types of books very fascinating! Can you learn to like
them?=
Is the reason that you and I did not finish them, that we have not yet=20
achieved the pinnacle of aesthetic development? Will we pick up the
book=20
in 10 years and love it?

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times

and think

Post by Scott Dorsey
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative

actually worked.

Post by Scott Dorsey
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to

read Dune

Post by Scott Dorsey
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad

school and

Post by Scott Dorsey
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried

reading it

Post by Scott Dorsey
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces

is enough.

Post by Lynn McGuire
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

<oops! forgot to add this -- lots of exposition.>
<a lot of exposition.> Which is probably why, the movie, it is the
Shouting Match of Elrond, which is degenerating into the Bar Brawl of
Elrond when Frodo speaks up.

Now "OZ" I bounced off of many times. Finally forced myself to finish
it a few years ago, but man it was a slog.

Do you remember why it was such a slog for you?
--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

Hard to say as I've already forgotten a lot of it, but some of it
was that everything was just so matter-of-fact for Dorothy. I never
felt she really reacted to anything farfetched happening, and never
felt she was in any danger.

--
columbiaclosings.com
What's not in Columbia anymore..

Robert Carnegie

2024-02-15 03:50:11 UTC

Post by Paul S Person
On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

Post by D
I find these types of books very fascinating! Can you learn to like
them?=
Is the reason that you and I did not finish them, that we have not
yet=20
achieved the pinnacle of aesthetic development? Will we pick up the
book=20
in 10 years and love it?

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times

and think

Post by Scott Dorsey
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative

actually worked.

Post by Scott Dorsey
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to

read Dune

Post by Scott Dorsey
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad

school and

Post by Scott Dorsey
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried

reading it

Post by Scott Dorsey
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and
approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces

is enough.

Post by Lynn McGuire
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

<oops! forgot to add this -- lots of exposition.>
<a lot of exposition.> Which is probably why, the movie, it is the
Shouting Match of Elrond, which is degenerating into the Bar Brawl of
Elrond when Frodo speaks up.

Now "OZ" I bounced off of many times. Finally forced myself to finish
it a few years ago, but man it was a slog.

Do you remember why it was such a slog for you?
--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

The first book... If you know some of
the plot before you get to it, which after
all is written into modern American culture,
then you don't get the effect of surprise.
It was written for children, of course.
Dorothy meets threats. But she also has
friends, and assets, that protect her
against, say, casual highwaymen. I don't
remember myself if there are highwaymen.
There are the Hammer-Heads as a hazard
to travelers. They're not in the film.
Oz is not a safe place whien Dorothy arrives.
And getting there was a traumatic experience
in itself.

Paul S Person

2024-02-15 16:41:47 UTC

On Thu, 15 Feb 2024 03:50:11 +0000, Robert Carnegie

Post by Robert Carnegie

Post by Paul S Person
On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

Post by D
I find these types of books very fascinating! Can you learn to like
them?=
Is the reason that you and I did not finish them, that we have not
yet=20
achieved the pinnacle of aesthetic development? Will we pick up the
book=20
in 10 years and love it?

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times

and think

Post by Scott Dorsey
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative

actually worked.

Post by Scott Dorsey
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to

read Dune

Post by Scott Dorsey
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad

school and

Post by Scott Dorsey
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried

reading it

Post by Scott Dorsey
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and
approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces

is enough.

Post by Lynn McGuire
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

<oops! forgot to add this -- lots of exposition.>
<a lot of exposition.> Which is probably why, the movie, it is the
Shouting Match of Elrond, which is degenerating into the Bar Brawl of
Elrond when Frodo speaks up.

Now "OZ" I bounced off of many times. Finally forced myself to finish
it a few years ago, but man it was a slog.

Do you remember why it was such a slog for you?
--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

My favorite Oz stories are /Zardoz/ and a short-story in which Glenda
is not as good as she seems and the Munchkins are her agents. The
climax comes when they switch a pitcher of water with one of acid.

Now /that/ made sense!

--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

Cryptoengineer

2024-02-15 18:07:52 UTC

Post by Paul S Person
On Thu, 15 Feb 2024 03:50:11 +0000, Robert Carnegie

Post by Robert Carnegie

Post by Paul S Person
On Tue, 13 Feb 2024 09:54:58 -0800, Robert Woodward

Post by D
I find these types of books very fascinating! Can you learn to like
them?=
Is the reason that you and I did not finish them, that we have not
yet=20
achieved the pinnacle of aesthetic development? Will we pick up the
book=20
in 10 years and love it?

I think so, but as I said, I had to read Dhalgren several times

and think

Post by Scott Dorsey
about it a lot in order to figure out how the narrative

actually worked.

Post by Scott Dorsey
My friend in 6th grade was a huge fan of Dune, and I started to

read Dune

Post by Scott Dorsey
and couldn't get into it. Years later (when I was out of grad

school and

Post by Scott Dorsey
finally had time to think about something else again) I tried

reading it

Post by Scott Dorsey
again and I thought it was wonderful. So yes, we might change and
approach
the book differently in the future.
--scott

I am not going to try The Lord Of The Rings again. Two bounces

is enough.

Post by Lynn McGuire
But I loved The Hobbit.
Lynn

Interesting! I like both Dune and Lord of the rings, so interesting to
hear that those two represent "problem books" for others.

I bounced from LOTR the first time, but the second time I persisted
unitl the silliness abated and we left Bree. From that point it
worked.

I bounced from _LOTR_ the first time as well (I think it was the Council
of Elrond where I lost interest - a committee scene - I might had been
15 at the time).

<oops! forgot to add this -- lots of exposition.>
<a lot of exposition.> Which is probably why, the movie, it is the
Shouting Match of Elrond, which is degenerating into the Bar Brawl of
Elrond when Frodo speaks up.

Now "OZ" I bounced off of many times. Finally forced myself to finish
it a few years ago, but man it was a slog.

Do you remember why it was such a slog for you?
--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

You might like 'Wicked'. Also, PJF's "A barnstormer in Oz'.

Oz was one of the first milieus to fall out of copyright, in 1956, but
I don't recall seeing anyone write new stories in it until the 80s.

pt

dgold

2024-02-12 20:18:48 UTC

Post by WolfFan
Dhalgren is one of those books like Joyce’s Ulysses or Pynchon’s
Gravity’s Rainbow which many have tried but few have actually read.

ah, "Ulysses" is just the prelude. *real* Joyce people actually finish
"Finnegans Wake"

Post by WolfFan
My memories
of Ulysses is dimmer, mostly because it was such an excellent sleep aide.
Dhalgren was much better. I still never finished it.

Likewise, for both.

--
dgold <***@dgold.eu>

Paul S Person

2024-02-13 16:19:36 UTC

Post by dgold

Dhalgren is one of those books like Joyces Ulysses or Pynchons
Gravitys Rainbow which many have tried but few have actually read.

ah, "Ulysses" is just the prelude. *real* Joyce people actually finish
"Finnegans Wake"

I know I used to own a copy, and I think I read it all the way
through, but I have no doubt at all that I understood none of it.

/Gravity's Rainbow/ and /Terra Nostra/, OTOH, I found both
comprehensible and entertaining.

Post by dgold

My memories
of Ulysses is dimmer, mostly because it was such an excellent sleep aide.
Dhalgren was much better. I still never finished it.

Likewise, for both.

--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"

William Hyde

2024-02-13 22:46:44 UTC

Post by WolfFan

Try as I might, I could not finish Dahlgren. I actually didn't all that far
into it. It rode in the back window of my old Toyota Corolla for years.

Thank you for sharing. I was also not able to get through Dhalgren.
Best regards,
Daniel

Exactly where I stopped.

Ulysses is a lot easier to read when you realize that it is a comedy. Also
if you have the version Joyce actually wrote, minus the thousand or so
misprints induced by early censorship (some of those nonsensical
utterances are actually nonsensical).

I read Dhalgren three times. I am not sure I could read it today. I've tried
the much slimmer Triton twice and not finished it.

My copy of Finnegan's wake has vanished. But I never seriously
attempted to read it.

William Hyde

Lynn McGuire

2024-02-10 20:39:15 UTC

Post by James Nicoll
Has a page fallen out of this mass market paperback, which I just purchased
in 1978?

Welcome to the club ! I have had many pages fall out of several MMPBs
over the decades. Never on a hardback or a trade paperback though, if
my memory is any good (which it is not).

Lynn

Titus G

2024-02-10 21:12:18 UTC

Post by James Nicoll
Has a page fallen out of this mass market paperback, which I just purchased
in 1978?

Because it wasn't a "well printed and well bound MMPB".

Lynn McGuire

2024-02-11 02:48:37 UTC

Post by Titus G

Post by James Nicoll
Has a page fallen out of this mass market paperback, which I just purchased
in 1978?

Because it wasn't a "well printed and well bound MMPB".

Thanks for getting it right !

Lynn

William Hyde

2024-02-11 20:04:29 UTC